Topic: UFP-1 Starfleet One released  (Read 10916 times)

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Offline Centurus

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #20 on: August 11, 2004, 06:51:06 pm »
Asking again if the corrected ship has been posted for download.  Hope you don't mind me asking again.
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Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #21 on: August 11, 2004, 10:32:30 pm »
I almost forgot about good ol' Don here.  Well... I do have respect of Fury's work and his opinions.  Honest disagreements happen, we're not all different.  And Don, if you're hoping to start a fight, I'll end it by ignoring you from here on in if you continue attacking me.  Otherwise I hope old flame wounds can heal up.  I'm sure we've matured enough over the years to be well above such on this forum...

As for Fury, I really like the work you're doing, especially on SG-related stuff for SFC.  I hope someone gets around to making more big ships, other than the Hataks floating around... :)

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Offline FoaS_XC

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2004, 10:45:47 pm »
lol, i wish i could model those, but they are a little beyond me.
Robinomicon
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Offline Centurus

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #23 on: August 16, 2004, 03:36:55 pm »
BUMP!!!!  Any update on this topic?  Last I heard, there was gonna be a Galaxy retexture.
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Offline battlestar001

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #24 on: August 18, 2004, 01:58:42 pm »
A galaxy aswell?? Pls pls tell me if its true. I Think that the president would fly around in a ship that would show off starfleet. So prehaps the most advanced class in the fleet?

Offline Centurus

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #25 on: August 19, 2004, 03:52:36 pm »
A galaxy aswell?? Pls pls tell me if its true. I Think that the president would fly around in a ship that would show off starfleet. So prehaps the most advanced class in the fleet?

The most advanced class in the fleet would have to be the Sovereign, and that's already been made into the President's Ship.
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Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #26 on: August 19, 2004, 04:14:47 pm »
He's a decade or two behind Daihak, the good, real TNG times before fanboy designs started in DS9. ;)

Only kidding!  And I have to admit ships like the Intrepid or Sovereign have beauty of their own.  Each ship has.

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Offline AgentSloan

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #27 on: August 19, 2004, 05:39:34 pm »
He's a decade or two behind Daihak, the good, real TNG times before fanboy designs started in DS9. ;)

Only kidding!  And I have to admit ships like the Intrepid or Sovereign have beauty of their own.  Each ship has.


Hello Chris Johnson,

Ole AgentSloan here,.... again,....

UFP Starfleet One



The "Presidents ship",...
much like the Real-Life USAs Air Force 1 is not only a "pleasure cruise-ship",...
It is a haven,... and "Castle-Keep" during dangerous times.

Having the USS Sovreign (the most advanced ship) for the UFP Presidents ship makes emment sense,...

"... The Minstrell-Boy to the War did go,..."
http://www.nightsoft.net/compictures/agentsloan/breaker3.mid


("ole Stompy's" Favourite song.  Killed at the Battle of Set-lek III).

i.e., if the Dominion/Cardassian invasion fleet had successfully defeated the Federation/Klingon/Romulan Allied Fleets,....
the UFP President would want the best, most advanced starship to flee in,
Indeed.



BTW,....
Please define the term "Fan-Boy" design,
I have NO idea what you talking about.


Take care,
AgentSloan
« Last Edit: August 19, 2004, 08:01:01 pm by AgentSloan »

Offline FoaS_XC

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #28 on: August 19, 2004, 07:27:16 pm »
A Fan-Boy design is one that is one where its advantages outweigh its disadvantages and is completely off the wall. IE: a ship with 50 transphasic, borg shielding, ablative armour, and a Caretaker powersource so there is absolutely no power drain...a Munchkin ship, you could call it.
Robinomicon
"When I was 5 years old, my mom always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down “happy.” They told me I didn’t understand the assignment and I told them they didn’t understand life."

Offline AgentSloan

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #29 on: August 19, 2004, 07:57:26 pm »
A Fan-Boy design is one that is one where its advantages outweigh its disadvantages and is completely off the wall. IE: a ship with 50 transphasic, borg shielding, ablative armour, and a Caretaker powersource so there is absolutely no power drain...a Munchkin ship, you could call it.



Hello Furyofaseraph, :)

Thank you for explaining the terminalogy to me,
I appreciate it alot eh.


Do you consider the USS Sovreign as a "Fan-Boy" design,...?


I for one, most certainly do not.


Take care, :)
AgentSloan

Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #30 on: August 19, 2004, 11:45:30 pm »
I for one, most certainly do, especially in Gene's own universe.  The second main ship in Berman's (then) new line of ships to have Quantum torpedoes, Starbase phasers (Ph4s), can easily destroy a borg ship (A Sovereign vs. Borg Sphere is fairly quick.  An Intrepid vs. Borg Sphere is almost as quick, but who takes the victory has been switched!), and its main purpose in our own real life is for it to look cool fighting.  Realistically in First Contact there would have been more New Orelans-class starships or Cheyenne-class.  I fail to see how quickly new ships can be designed and spun out and overwhelm and replace the Galaxy-class-esque fleet (as in how most ships look like the Galaxy-class, similar to how non-canonical TOS and TMP designs relate to the Constitution-class) and leave a few Mirandas and Excelsiors in.  How much resources did starfleet waste when they were considering replacing a ship like the New Orelans with a ship liike the Steamrunner?  It's unrealistic thinking.  Of course, in real life we needed cooler, more fanboyish-looking ships to be in First contact so Starfleet could look cool fighting the Borg, who since their early-1990s days had a makeover of their own.

The Galaxy-class was to be beautiful, yes, but considering the reactions of a newer generation of Star Trek fans, it holds more inner-beauty than outer.  While in its day was really armed, it wasn't truely a battleship; it was designed for long-range exploration in mind, with both civilians and starfleet personell coexisting.  She may be armed, but even Excelsior captains think of Galaxy-class flyboys getting soft in that luxury liner! (Based off a quote from DeSoto in "Tin Man" [TNG]. ;) )  The Galaxy-class, while potentially being a battleship, was actually one of exploration, and was designed for everyone in mind, even for civilians who would volunteer to serve in that ship (or just live in it).

Down to the point: the Galaxy-class had more of Gene's vision in mind than the Sovereign-class, clearly designed to look cool while fighting.  This is my opinion.


Also, keep in mind that Starfleet's mission was one more of than peace and exploration then one of war.  Starfleet was reckless in its battle of the Dominion, by making new ship designs, and throwing away ones that weren't so old, while keeping two very-old ship designs that have outlived their days, much like the Constitution-class, which was never mainly featured in a TNG episode.

DS9 may have been a fairly decent series, but it did have its faults.  The Dominion War, IMHO, was Berman's way of boosting ratings.  After all, we do like seeing Starship combat, do we? ;)
« Last Edit: August 19, 2004, 11:57:17 pm by Chris Johnson »

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Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #31 on: August 20, 2004, 01:59:26 am »
I also like to note: Nice description of a Fanboy ship Fury.  But I think by your description it's more like those super fan-boy god-ships from Bridge Commander. ;) Meaning nice description, but a bit of an overstatement.

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Offline AgentSloan

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #32 on: August 20, 2004, 11:02:31 am »
I for one, most certainly do, especially in Gene's own universe.  The second main ship in Berman's (then) new line of ships to have Quantum torpedoes, Starbase phasers (Ph4s), can easily destroy a borg ship (A Sovereign vs. Borg Sphere is fairly quick.  An Intrepid vs. Borg Sphere is almost as quick, but who takes the victory has been switched!), and its main purpose in our own real life is for it to look cool fighting.  Realistically in First Contact there would have been more New Orelans-class starships or Cheyenne-class.  I fail to see how quickly new ships can be designed and spun out and overwhelm and replace the Galaxy-class-esque fleet (as in how most ships look like the Galaxy-class, similar to how non-canonical TOS and TMP designs relate to the Constitution-class) and leave a few Mirandas and Excelsiors in.  How much resources did starfleet waste when they were considering replacing a ship like the New Orelans with a ship liike the Steamrunner?  It's unrealistic thinking.  Of course, in real life we needed cooler, more fanboyish-looking ships to be in First contact so Starfleet could look cool fighting the Borg, who since their early-1990s days had a makeover of their own.

The Galaxy-class was to be beautiful, yes, but considering the reactions of a newer generation of Star Trek fans, it holds more inner-beauty than outer.  While in its day was really armed, it wasn't truely a battleship; it was designed for long-range exploration in mind, with both civilians and starfleet personell coexisting.  She may be armed, but even Excelsior captains think of Galaxy-class flyboys getting soft in that luxury liner! (Based off a quote from DeSoto in "Tin Man" [TNG]. ;) )  The Galaxy-class, while potentially being a battleship, was actually one of exploration, and was designed for everyone in mind, even for civilians who would volunteer to serve in that ship (or just live in it).

Down to the point: the Galaxy-class had more of Gene's vision in mind than the Sovereign-class, clearly designed to look cool while fighting.  This is my opinion.


Also, keep in mind that Starfleet's mission was one more of than peace and exploration then one of war.  Starfleet was reckless in its battle of the Dominion, by making new ship designs, and throwing away ones that weren't so old, while keeping two very-old ship designs that have outlived their days, much like the Constitution-class, which was never mainly featured in a TNG episode.

DS9 may have been a fairly decent series, but it did have its faults.  The Dominion War, IMHO, was Berman's way of boosting ratings.  After all, we do like seeing Starship combat, do we? ;)

Hello Chris Johnson, :)

The standard lexicon of Star Trek includes,

Star Trek: TOS, 1966-1969 AD,
Star Trek: The Next Generation, 1987-1994 AD,
Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, 1993-1999 AD,
Star Trek: Voyager, 1995-2001 AD,
Star Trek: Enterprise, 2001-?

You can not dismiss a starship as being invalid, just because you don't like it, Chris.

The USS Sovreign is an accepted UFP starship design.


Take care, :)
Agent Sloan 

Offline Reverend

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #33 on: August 20, 2004, 01:36:16 pm »
Here, here, here, lets not be fussy now... :P
Sovereign's kinda wild, but its further into the future, and all that. Everything gets condensed with tech advances, so on...

Offline battlestar001

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #34 on: August 20, 2004, 01:58:34 pm »
The Sovvy makes a fine addition to the feelt

Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #35 on: August 20, 2004, 02:09:13 pm »
He thinks I should be restricted to canonical stuff.  Well, I have seen the light and broken free of the awful discontinuities of Enterprise.

I don't care if the UFP accepted the Sovereign design, they were wasting resources just to make a fanboy ship for Picard.   Either that, or the real life explination, Berman wanted a fanboy ship for Patrick Stewart to act in and for the audience to adore.  Well, I don't adore it.  Besides, why waste a perfectly good 2360s Starfleet that could've had a simple upgrade?  That would've been better off than spinning off new designs so quick to fight the Borg in FC and the Dominion in DS9.  Although the only time we see Sovereign-class starships was in the TNG movies...

The Sovereign is an accepted ship by many because it looks good, and many recent thoughts about the Galaxy-class was that it was ugly compared to the Sovereign.  Well, a big hot rod like the Sovereign can get all the attention it wants.  My fandom lays on what Don express in his sig as a class not worth getting; A now-underlooked, underappreciated class who had the tradition of having the fifth starship to bear the name Enterprise in its lineage of ships.  I for one see the inner and outer beauty of the Galaxy-class.

Now do not get me wrong, I still have some love for the Sovereign-class mainly because it carries the sixth starship to bear the name Enterprise and has the crew a new generation of TV-watchers grew up with, but it really doesen't have much appeal to me because when I look at it, it just looks cool, nothing more.  Just... Eye-candy.  When I see the Enterprise-D, it's one of two ships I grew up with that had been on the spotlight; the other being the original Constitution-class U.S.S. Enterprise.  For Enterprise-D, I had a nice time growing up with them.  But the feeling of enjoyment I got with either ship and crew, I rarely got with the Enterprise-E.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2004, 02:35:32 pm by Chris Johnson »

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Offline AgentSloan

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #36 on: August 20, 2004, 03:18:44 pm »
Here, here, here, lets not be fussy now... :P
Sovereign's kinda wild, but its further into the future, and all that. Everything gets condensed with tech advances, so on...

LOL! :) Revenend,...

Me ole AgentSloan,.... fussy,...?
Yep  ;D

Fussy, testy, and Fireband!
 :D

Offline AgentSloan

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #37 on: August 20, 2004, 03:20:09 pm »
He thinks I should be restricted to canonical stuff.  Well, I have seen the light and broken free of the awful discontinuities of Enterprise.

I don't care if the UFP accepted the Sovereign design, they were wasting resources just to make a fanboy ship for Picard.   Either that, or the real life explination, Berman wanted a fanboy ship for Patrick Stewart to act in and for the audience to adore.  Well, I don't adore it.  Besides, why waste a perfectly good 2360s Starfleet that could've had a simple upgrade?  That would've been better off than spinning off new designs so quick to fight the Borg in FC and the Dominion in DS9.  Although the only time we see Sovereign-class starships was in the TNG movies...

The Sovereign is an accepted ship by many because it looks good, and many recent thoughts about the Galaxy-class was that it was ugly compared to the Sovereign.  Well, a big hot rod like the Sovereign can get all the attention it wants.  My fandom lays on what Don express in his sig as a class not worth getting; A now-underlooked, underappreciated class who had the tradition of having the fifth starship to bear the name Enterprise in its lineage of ships.  I for one see the inner and outer beauty of the Galaxy-class.

Now do not get me wrong, I still have some love for the Sovereign-class mainly because it carries the sixth starship to bear the name Enterprise and has the crew a new generation of TV-watchers grew up with, but it really doesen't have much appeal to me because when I look at it, it just looks cool, nothing more.  Just... Eye-candy.  When I see the Enterprise-D, it's one of two ships I grew up with that had been on the spotlight; the other being the original Constitution-class U.S.S. Enterprise.  For Enterprise-D, I had a nice time growing up with them.  But the feeling of enjoyment I got with either ship and crew, I rarely got with the Enterprise-E.


Hello Chris Johnson, :)

Actually,... the USS Sovreign is an accepted UFP design becuase the Producers of the Star Trek: First Contact Movie deemed it so.
They say so.
Neither you nor I, can dispute that.

Additionally,... in the Canon-Literature of the Star Trek Encyclopedia (updated 1999 AD version),
the USS Sovreign is also denoted as an accepted UFP design.
Right there in "black-and-white".




USS Sovreign (Enterprise-E, most advanced UFP starship, thus the best for UFP Pres.)
USS Galaxy (Enterprise-D),
USS Ambassador (Enterprise-C).



Next up,

My signature.

Its the 5th Frame in sequence of 5 pics of the "USS Odessey Death Scene".
The Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Episode called "The Jem'Hadar" (season ender of the 3rd season).

Why did I pick it,....?

Its was not becuase I don't like the USS Galaxy-Class.
On the contrary, I think its a beautiful starship design.
As well I think the USS Sovreign is a beautiful design as well.

"USS Odessey Death Scene": Frame 1


"USS Odessey Death Scene": Frame 2


"USS Odessey Death Scene": Frame 3


"USS Odessey Death Scene": Frame 4


"USS Odessey Death Scene": Frame 5



I picked the "Death Scene pic" (the whole sequence posted above),
as a reminder to me "... pride go-eth before a fall,...".

As  the leader of Section 31 "moi Agent Sloan",.... believes the following,

The United Federation of Planets had grown complacent, and frankly arrogant,
We thought NO-ONE COULD DEFEAT US.

Well we were wrong.
The Dominion was willing to go to "any length to defeat us".
(just like the Kamakazee run that destroyed the USS Odessey, ole Captain Koeing, and her 1200 crew).


What is my favourite Enterprise design,...?
The USS Ambassador Class, the Enterprise-C.

(that design "Yesterdays Enterprise" got me watching the show after giving up on it).


Take care,
AgentSloan
« Last Edit: August 20, 2004, 04:18:33 pm by AgentSloan »

Offline Chris Johnson

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #38 on: August 20, 2004, 04:17:41 pm »
I think you were just making the same argument that didn't get the point I was trying to make.  I said I didn't give a care about what Paramount thinks.  I won't restrict myself to canonical material.  I don't care if the Sovereign is an accepted design.  I accept it too.  I don't like it a lot, but I accept it.

Now lets get back on topic, shall we?

The U.S.S. Sovereign is a ship of battle with all of what she's carrying, not a ship of peace, and Starfleet wants peace, right?

The most ideal ship for diplomatic/presidential purposes has to be the Galaxy-class Starship.  Oh sure, the Sovereign-class Starship exists and it is one of the most advanced designs... Oh wait, the Prometheus-class is even more advanced.  Now how do you account for forgetting it was canonical too?  It's even more a ship of war than the slightly-less advanced Sovereign-class starship, which is slightly-more advanced than the Galaxy-class starship.
Be it Sovereign or Prometheus, a ship of battle is necessary to defend the president.  This doesen't mean the president has to be in it.  Frankly I think ships of battle are a bigger threat and a bigger target for the enemy to pick on.  For the end of the 2360s it was the Galaxy-class Starship.  For the beginning of the 2370s it was the Defiant and Sovereign warships.  For the mid-2370s we have your Prometheus-class, and it was quite a sight indeed that the Tal Shiar wanted to capture the vessel for themselves and study it!  If the president needs a ship of battle, he could beam aboard one and claim it "Starfleet One" for a while.  Or he could order it to be an escort to defend the president.  Have the warship as a distraction while the President cowers out to survive another day in his term.
The Galaxy-class starship is a ship of peace and exploration, and perfect for diplomatic relations.  It is a class of starship most symbolic of the Federation, a government seeking peace and exploring to see what's out there.  Also, how do you account for the absence of Sovereign-class ships during the Dominion War?  There's only one hint and it was a remark said by Picard, and we don't know how many Sovereign-class ships have been made.  It's a new class and 100 ships can't be easily spun out.  If anything it should be harder to make than a Galaxy-class.  And aside from practically the first of her class, the only known canonical Starship of said class was the Enterprise-E.  Of course, having a presidential ship is non-canon, yes.  But that doesen't mean we should ignore canon, as you frequently suggest.  Also, there are about twelve, maybe thirteen Galaxy-class starships, a few of them with unknown names.  One of them could be a presidential ship reserved for the President of the UFP to use for Diplomatic purposes, hypothetically speaking.  It's also more practical to waste resources just for the President to have a ship slightly-more advanced than a Galaxy-class.

Quite frankly, I believe either way, the President would have a ship less powerful than another in the same class, and probably less advanced too.  Should the president want defense, that's what escorts are for.  You see important figures in cars guarded by police cars and motorcycles?  Especially the President's car.  They are his defense.  And so should starships escorting the UFP's president, if necessary.

It just makes more sense to me to picture a Galaxy-class presidential ship guarded by a few powerful ships (I.E. Ambassador-class, or Akira, or what not), than just a loner armed-to-the-teeth warship painted to be a presidential ship.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2004, 04:38:22 pm by Chris Johnson »

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Offline AgentSloan

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Re: UFP-1 Starfleet One released
« Reply #39 on: August 20, 2004, 04:19:34 pm »
I think you were just making the same argument that didn't get the point I was trying to make.  I said I didn't give a care about what Paramount thinks.  I won't restrict myself to canonical material.  I don't care if the Sovereign is an accepted design.  I accept it too.  I don't like it a lot, but I accept it.

Now lets get back on topic, shall we?


Ahem,...
How are you not talking about Canonical Material,...?
Eh,...?