Topic: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)  (Read 9683 times)

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Offline d4v1ks

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #100 on: April 29, 2017, 02:15:55 pm »
Yes, it works perfectly with SFC3.
That was the point of the video. :)
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Offline FA Frey XC

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #101 on: May 15, 2017, 12:41:59 pm »
I have stickied this thread.

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Offline vonfrank

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #102 on: September 25, 2017, 10:32:57 am »
Good to see this hasn't been forgotten... I was starting to wonder if the project had quietly died.

Offline d4v1ks

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #103 on: September 26, 2017, 10:35:19 am »
Quiet, but not dead.
This project will eventually materialize in some kind of release as we did before.
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Offline GodlyDevil

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #104 on: October 05, 2017, 11:19:45 am »
Hello.
My first post in these forums.. Please forgive me if I'm overstepping it something.

I've tried the link at the top of this topic and all links in between, but i can't download the server prog.. Where do I get or where can I download it?

thanks in advance
GD

Offline matchbox2022

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #105 on: November 18, 2017, 08:49:25 pm »
Same....
Hope its not a "demand to donate thing" which is illegal for mods based on another license.
I'd love to donate but forcing isn't cool (I design my own sounds and scripts for mods for other games and never do that).
That'd defn alienate any players.
Organizing with buying the game itself from dynaverse as part of "upkeep costs" is an entirely different story.

Offline d4v1ks

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #106 on: November 19, 2017, 08:57:08 am »
Previous versions of the SFCLauncher, like all the tools related to these games, were made available for free in the last 2 years.
The work on the games, like the SFC3 , SFC2CE, SFC2EAW or the SFC2OP patches, that we can call a MOD, were also distributed for free.

The SFCLauncher software is not a mod. It is a personal project developed by me, updated, and maintained for private use.
The program is not required to use any of the mods above.

Which you call a "demand to donate" has nothing to do with the program.
It is a way for people to show appreciation for the time I invested in these projects.
You can't buy the SFCLauncher, nor i will give to you based in any kind of donation.
It is something that i decided to do, an improvement. It is up to people to choose how they will interact.
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Offline vonfrank

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #107 on: November 20, 2017, 02:58:16 pm »
Wait a minute...

Is this no longer available unless a patreon donation is made?  :huh:

Offline matchbox2022

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #108 on: November 20, 2017, 09:38:58 pm »
Yeah...I've made exes specifically linking to another exe for a mod as well....to the point where it solves individual errors in the original program and hex edits on the fly......
that's still called A MOD, and because it's based on another guys work, I can not charge for it.
Providing a doorway to use the original game in a new way still uses the original game so....can easily see a legal issue here with demand to donate, which is exactly what you've done.

It's no different than other programs people "coded" to work with assets in the game. (Shipedit.exe Q3Editor.exe FMSE.exe, even hexeditors and various shareware/freeware).

Is it a standalone game, use your own assets or allow for a license to create additional IP? No? Then what you've done is began to alienate player bases, potentially illegally. Like I said before, donate to download is a fancy way of saying I need compensation, which is fine to ASK for, not demand for personal projects based on OTHER IP.

If people aren't donating the solution is pretty simple....make your own content based on your own IP completely where you CAN charge.....or stop providing your experience in volunteering and make it known as to the time limitations and some need to keep afloat.
Making people "donate to show appreciation" in order to use something which links to a license for software they "already bought" is a slippery ####ing slope.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 09:49:05 pm by matchbox2022 »

Offline vonfrank

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #109 on: November 20, 2017, 10:05:53 pm »
Yeah...I've made exes specifically linking to another exe for a mod as well....to the point where it solves individual errors in the original program and hex edits on the fly......
that's still called A MOD, and because it's based on another guys work, I can not charge for it.
Providing a doorway to use the original game in a new way still uses the original game so....can easily see a legal issue here with demand to donate, which is exactly what you've done.

It's no different than other programs people "coded" to work with assets in the game. (Shipedit.exe Q3Editor.exe FMSE.exe, even hexeditors and various shareware/freeware).

Is it a standalone game, use your own assets or allow for a license to create additional IP? No? Then what you've done is began to alienate player bases, potentially illegally. Like I said before, donate to download is a fancy way of saying I need compensation, which is fine to ASK for, not demand for personal projects based on OTHER IP.

If people aren't donating the solution is pretty simple....make your own content based on your own IP completely where you CAN charge.....or stop providing your experience in volunteering and make it known as to the time limitations and some need to keep afloat.
Making people "donate to show appreciation" in order to use something which links to a license for software they "already bought" is a slippery ####ing slope.

Completely agree.

IF this is whats happening (and d4v1ks, correct me if I'm wrong) this is not good at all. And with all of the controversy about EA going on right now, this is really poor timing to try and charge people for access to things that should not be paid for. Regardless of the fact that this is an external program for the SFC games, it is still FOR the SFC games, and as a result, there can be no pay-wall for it.

I appreciate that modding is something that takes a lot of time, and we, as adults, quite often have little time to spare, but that doesn't excuse this. If you don't want to make the mod, then you don't have to. We may all appreciate the release of the mod, but no one is forcing you to devote your time to it. Conversely, you shouldn't force us to pay you if you decide to create it anyway.

If you want, put an optional donation up on the download page. This will enable people to download, test, and enjoy the mod with the availability to donate to you for your service to the community AFTER they have given it a try. This is the proper (and only legal) way to go about it.

Offline d4v1ks

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #110 on: November 21, 2017, 08:49:51 am »
...stop providing your experience in volunteering and make it known

you shouldn't force us to pay you if you decide to create it anyway.

The patreon page was created for people with a different mindset.
There is a lot of people that think my time and efforts are meaningless and so on, at least when compared to theirs.
And then there is a hand of people that contacts me and write: 'I like what you are doing and I want to support you!'
This version is being updated for those.

Like I said, the program is not for sale. Nor available based in any kind of donation.
The patreon is just a way of setting goals for me and let you be part of it.

Because lets be realistic.
You can see the pictures and videos. I've got a working version for more than an year by now. Even if it was not 'perfect' i know how it works, and i know how to operate it well.
The new version is not being made for me. It is for you. Those that have problems setting a working version or wish something more.

I've raised the goal there to 1 billion dollars.
That should put things in the right perspective.
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Offline vonfrank

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #111 on: November 21, 2017, 09:02:46 pm »

There is a lot of people that think my time and efforts are meaningless and so on, at least when compared to theirs.
And then there is a hand of people that contacts me and write: 'I like what you are doing and I want to support you!'
This version is being updated for those.


No one said we thought your time and effort was meaningless. In fact, most of us were praising your efforts.... up until now.

And as far as donations for support are concerned, there's nothing wrong with accepting them, but requiring them for the 'updated version' is completely different. Essentially what you're saying is; "Here's the free version of my modding program! It's great inst it? A few bugs and its incomplete.... BUT WAIT! You can get the 'New and improved' version for a mere $5 donation! And I'm not just trying to make money because I'm not SELLING it to you, I'm letting you be a part of the creation process! Don't you feel a sense of accomplishment?"

Do you see how messed up that is? I'm sorry man, because I really love the work you've done and I probably would have even supported you with a gratuity donation once the completed version was made available and I had given it a try.  But now? Now you're just trying to make a buck.... And that's sad, especially since you cant even admit it to yourself.

So as far as I'm concerned, this mod is dead. My friends and I who were all looking forward to this will be quite disappointed. If you decide to change your mind down the road, then I'll be back. Until then, good luck...

Offline d4v1ks

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #112 on: November 22, 2017, 04:12:49 am »
Lets assume you are right, when you say that i'm just trying to win a buck and sell the software for a minimum of $5.
Imagine that you and your friends pay that amount between yourselfs, 50 cents each, in a 10 people sample.
I dunno who you are or were you live, but lets assume you work in USA in a laundry and win an average of $10 per hour (hypothetical example):

$10 = 3600 seconds
50 cent = 180 seconds

From this point of view you and your 9 friends would have access to the new version in exchange of 3 minuts of your time, right?

But lets continue with this assumption...
When you write things like "I appreciate that modding is something that takes a lot of time", "no one said we thought your time and effort was meaningless", "I probably would have even supported you", what you mean by that?
When you write "we may all appreciate the release of the mod" and "now (...) as far as I'm concerned, this mod is dead", what message are you trying to send?

Looking at the example above i could argue that this project, for you and your friends, is not worth 3 minuts of your time.
Even worse, i could assume that this project don't even deserve the time you spent reading and replying to these posts, right?

But lets keep this assumption...
Put yourself in my place.
What you would reply to a person that writes that several days of your time is not worth 3 minuts of theirs?
If that person said that he appreciates your time would you really believe in him?
And then your wife takes just takes a look in your monitor, reads the replies, and yawns: "I'm tired of seeing you wasting time with people that clearly doesn't care about you. Why don't you just stop it?"
"Don't you feel a sense of accomplishment?"

Even if i was trying to sell the software "do you see how messed up" this assumption is?
It just gets worse and worse...

good luck...

Thanks man :)
"But he isn't wearing anything at all!" (The Emperor's New Clothes)

Offline d4v1ks

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #113 on: November 22, 2017, 04:13:36 am »
The progress of the project can be tracked here.
"But he isn't wearing anything at all!" (The Emperor's New Clothes)

Offline TarMinyatur

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #114 on: November 22, 2017, 08:47:35 am »
Curious that some humans will pay $6 for a game that doesn't work for multiplayer dynaverse mode. Curious that they will pay $6 for an archived game with no active support. But if an unpaid & unassisted programmer devotes hundreds of hours of labor to fix this situation, he is criticized for being greedy or antisocial for valuing his work. Curious that some people believe that any software that is SFC-related actually belongs to the public (as soon as proof-of-concept is established), must be given freely forever, or never made available. I'm not talking about lawyers (who will sue over hot coffee or shut down Star Trek fan-made material), I'm talking about players.

If dynaverse.net were selling 2.564 with enhanced multiplayer services for $6, would anyone complain? I doubt it.

I'm glad I'm a Gorn and not a human. We are an appreciative speciesss with good mannersss. You humansss are ssstrange.

Offline Captain Adam

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #115 on: November 22, 2017, 09:11:37 am »
 :thumbsup:

Offline AlDaja

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #116 on: November 22, 2017, 03:12:11 pm »
Curious that some humans will pay $6 for a game that doesn't work for multiplayer dynaverse mode. Curious that they will pay $6 for an archived game with no active support. But if an unpaid & unassisted programmer devotes hundreds of hours of labor to fix this situation, he is criticized for being greedy or antisocial for valuing his work. Curious that some people believe that any software that is SFC-related actually belongs to the public (as soon as proof-of-concept is established), must be given freely forever, or never made available. I'm not talking about lawyers (who will sue over hot coffee or shut down Star Trek fan-made material), I'm talking about players.

If dynaverse.net were selling 2.564 with enhanced multiplayer services for $6, would anyone complain? I doubt it.
Well said.
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Offline Tus-XC

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #117 on: November 22, 2017, 07:48:49 pm »
to many fools out there.   keep it up D4, I've bought you a beer for your time and effort - it was the least i could do.
Rob

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Offline matchbox2022

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #118 on: November 22, 2017, 11:41:51 pm »
Curious that some humans will pay $6 for a game that doesn't work for multiplayer dynaverse mode. Curious that they will pay $6 for an archived game with no active support. But if an unpaid & unassisted programmer devotes hundreds of hours of labor to fix this situation, he is criticized for being greedy or antisocial for valuing his work. Curious that some people believe that any software that is SFC-related actually belongs to the public (as soon as proof-of-concept is established), must be given freely forever, or never made available. I'm not talking about lawyers (who will sue over hot coffee or shut down Star Trek fan-made material), I'm talking about players.

If dynaverse.net were selling 2.564 with enhanced multiplayer services for $6, would anyone complain? I doubt it.

I'm glad I'm a Gorn and not a human. We are an appreciative speciesss with good mannersss. You humansss are ssstrange.

Then that's what needs to happen, to allow for financial contribution without relying on a donation.
FYI, we don't mind donating as a lot of us still play and think it's worthwhile. Me paying to get things running on a new machine slickly for the price of a coffee? like an expansion idea? Yeah I would. But it needs to be done the right way.
It is just as much about the lawyers as it is the players. That's the real world guys, licensing and intellectual property / what you can do with it MATTERS.

There's a few artists that go about this in a more creative way (although its entirely their own intellectual property) too, asking for donations for their music as a "pay what you think its worth" scheme. I think Ben Prunty was one of them as I bought a few albums off of him. And I did not select 0$.
I justified what made sense based on my income and the value of the entertainment I was getting and paid based on that. Fact is, they made money off me by not subjecting me to a way of thinking that required me to justify myself why "NOT" to get it, the pricetag.


...
Just a thought as to having a donation button versus a paytag....it's partly lack of advertising / popularity and partly the limited playerbase at fault for why the donation method may not have been providing "ANY" compensation (especially when all your players donate "once" and then that's that without any new players coming in from either buying from GOG or here), which when you are providing something to the public in order to continue "ENJOYING it", far past its lifespan, yeah I agree you could use some.
The way you ask for something has a much larger impact than you think as well as the passage of time.
So maybe what I wrote above is a potential solution? Certainly getting people who buy the game now in the "know" about how to truly "get the game working the way it should" through these mods...that or updates simply rolled into the stock game and collecting revenue as a contributor to the update.
But tying the hands of the limited playerbase is NOT the way to do it.

Look at Black Mesa Source. Hell they didn't charge for YEARS of work as a MOD based on Half-Life (Valve/Steam), and BAM its being sold on Steam like bikinis sell cars...where the creators are getting compensation legally.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 11:56:29 pm by matchbox2022 »

Offline TarMinyatur

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Re: SFC Launcher (a dynaverse and gamespy's online services replacement)
« Reply #119 on: November 23, 2017, 10:07:44 am »
How are anyone's hands "being tied" by the SFC Launcher? There have been free versions of everything that Carlos, Adam, TAnimal, and I have worked on for years as hobbyists.

Taldren, Interplay, Paramount, Activision, ADB, Quicksilver, and Gamespy have been the corporations that have tied the hands of the players of SFC. Facing these challenges, Dynaverse.net has been unable or unwilling to fix Orion Pirates (no source code is clearly a hurdle) and the results of a discordant volunteer effort gave us SFC: Community Edition in 2012, which is essentially obsolete and historical software. But we ought to honor these defunct and uncooperative corporations? Because that's how the real world works?

The SFC community is an insignificant blip to commercial Star Trek interests. Steve Cole wants $50,000 minimum to consider any idea related to Star Fleet Battles. He'd take the money and then could reject the idea. His stubborness is ridiculous.

No, we will almost certainly get no help from the IP holders (aside from this forum). It is up to those who love the game to work on it. And those of us who appreciate that investment of intellect, can show our appreciation through their own hex-editing, artistic content creation, or by giving money to those who have the time and talent for SFC. If we expect something for nothing, we've done pretty well thus far! The modding utilities, texture upgrades, and 2.037, 2.563, 2.679 are all improvements on the official versions. They cost exactly $0.