Topic: WIP Chabot Refit....  (Read 15501 times)

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Offline OlBuzzard

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #60 on: March 22, 2006, 04:20:33 pm »
It's obvious that the entire matter has been overshadowed ...

No I will not stop by the 9th forums ..   There is no need to remove your question.  It is obvious that the simple request made by the designer, and original mod developer (where the ship was first introduced) is being ignored.

My only involvement in this was (originally) to add support to my sons request.  It seems that his plea was and still is not only falling on deaf ears but as well creating controversy.  He and I both are being judged harshly for being the bad guys as though there were something either evil, dishonest, threatening, or of bad taste.

This attitude that has been presented primarily to my son ..  ( I just made the mistake of agreeing with him ) and now to me is so unbelievable. 

And for what reason ?

Oh ...  I forgot .. (senior moment ..   us old folks have a real problem with that ya know) ...

respect ! ?

concern ! ?

defiance ?

I'm sure it's all my fault some where in there.

If you aim at nothing:  you WILL hit it every time !

Offline F9thRyker

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #61 on: March 22, 2006, 08:17:10 pm »
Controversy is only kept going at all, when those who want to see it keep going, keep stoking it up. Honestly, its a mountain out of a molehill - that goes for everyone, not solely Buzz, Centurus and not Nanner - all things considered, all three have kept remarkably cool heads throughout this. A credit to all of you.


Anyway. It. Is. Only. A. Model. When all's said and done, its a fictional model, in a fictional universe, created by someone who has put a lot of time into it - represented by a fictional character in this world we call SFC. ;)


So much hassle over so much fiction. Urgh.


I *knew* there was a reason Ive been taking a long, *long* break from fleet stuff. Stuff like this.

Just FYI - I havent flown an OP campaign since KCW, and havent done a SFC3 one since NDF4. Im not planning to again in the near future, not only because my "real life" career prospects have, finally, seemed to take off, I have simply not had time to play, let alone sort out fleet stuff.



[The "Real Me" - Jason Greenwood, for this paragraph. No Ryker, no online character, no SFC stuff. Just plain old me]


When I come back of an evening, I kick in Birth of the Federation (anyone remember that?) and hope I find the Zakdorn before any other race does, so I can train my starships to Badass proportions  ;D Maybe sink a couple of cans, ring up some old school mates, check on my schedule, and basically do work-stuff. Its going well, better than I could have hoped - IT support in a musical theatre school for children. I like musical theatre, plus I have a BSc (Hons) in Applied Computer Technology - it is a work-placement made in Heaven. I couldn't have asked for a better one, and Im very happy with it- with any luck, this 3-6 month placement will turn into a "proper" salaried job.

To this end, Ive been putting in a lot of time extra-hours on career development skills, and in terms of online stuff; well. Ive left fleet business in the hands of those people better at it now than I am, as it should be. If this situation continues, I will most probably retire or stand aside, and let someone with the drive, enthusiasm and passion for this game that I once had, take my place.


However, since it seems I cant be left in peace to enjoy my twilight days with this game. Urgh.



[Puts on the "Ryker" hat]


Officially, Centurus isnt part of the 9th Fleet anymore. For the record, I will state that while he was with us, he remarked to several members of the fleet, including myself, about how great a model the Chabot was, but that as it was designed to be something just used for SFC - namely a kitbash - the model itself did not stand up to close scrutiny.

To this end, he came to the Fleet about creating a new model, of the exact (or as close as possible) type and configuration of the original, but with a much higher level of detail. Specifics here Im not sure of, but I believe it was intented for high-quality rendering work, as well as use in Bridge Commander.

Since this model was intimately associated with the Ninth, it was felt that a high-resolution re-build, to the same specifications, would help "spread the word" about the 9th, and it's origins with Ghis (who the ship was named for). Also, as Centurus pointed out, several other modellers were already taking an interest in reworking the Chabot, and it was felt that, despite some of them being exceptionally fine modellers, that to keep it "in house" would keep a sense of attachment of the ship to the fleet, just as it was when Nannerslug designed and made the original kitbash.

And so, Cent went to work. Early un-named WIPs looked promising, and as long as it stayed as faithful as was possible to the original design, I was content with letting it continue.


However. The issue of naming it came up. Since it wasnt a "refit" or kitbash, but nothing short of a total, 100% rebuild of an existing model, the original name of "Chabot" seemed to make sense. Case in point - the original in-game models. Im sure someone holds the rights to the design for the Galaxy class ship, somewhere at Paramount. However, Galaxy class models made here arent called "Mark 2", or "Type 195" Galaxy, they're just called "Galaxy" class ship. Most cases, I believe, the name of the author is included in the description for the model, but not the "class" itself in-game.


[Personally, I consider the original Chabot to be the Nanner Chabot, and the rebuild to be the Centurus one, for the same reason. In game, I'd still call it the Chabot, for the purposes of discriminating between the two though, I'd call them the Nanner and Cent Chabots.]


Sometime later, Centurus felt that his time in the fleet had come to a close (as Im feeling right now), and decided to retire. I suggested to him possibly renaming the ship the "Thrain", - "Chabot Mk 2" seems silly when its exactly the same ship, and after many many man-hours of work have gone into making sure it is the same.

On the face of it, this should stay between Centurus and Nanner. Nanner's father, nor the 9th Fleet, has any business getting involved - Cent isnt part of the 9th, so while this was "our" idea in the earlier stages, anything he chooses to do regarding this, I cant really do much.

I will say this though, on a personal note. Centurus is a good person, who has been through far FAR too much hassle recently over this. As Nanner himself said,

"My suggestion would be for Cent to simply rename the model. If he chooses not to do so the world wont end or anything like that - I mean, my goodnes, its JUST a model for a game. We shouldnt get all huffy over anything."


I agree totally. It is a nice looking computer file, of a fictional ship, in a fictional universe, made for a game and TV series which is, to be fair, dying out. Its a *model*, its not the Crown Jewels, or a Renaissance-era copy of the Bible worth millions we're talking about here.

Its a bloody model. Person A makes it, person B re-makes it as faithfully as possible.   Persons C, D, E, and their brothers and former room-mates get involved, and makes it into something much more than it actually is - a model of a ship, made in tribute to a model of a ship, which was made in tribute to someone we once knew.


Final thought- wait until Centurus, or whoever has it right now, has finished it with a full retexture. Then, if you still want to go ahead and judge it, then judge the Finished Article.


If there's still crap going on over this then, maybe Cent could go to Nanner for comments and feedback as to how to tweak it; since he knows the mesh inside and out, he's and P81 are probably the best people to go to. Or, *shocker* idea here, maybe Nanner could modify Cent's mesh and release it too as his own update?

Shocker indeed.  ;D



Springers Final Thought:

Something I learned recently - there's more to life than pissing contests. If that applies to real life, then it sure as hell should apply here too.





[Now I remember why I dont play SFC any more. None of this hassle in single-player Birth of the Federation  ;D]
« Last Edit: March 22, 2006, 08:34:01 pm by Jason Greenwood »


The four most powerful men in the galaxy:

The President of the United Federation of Planets...
The Chancellor of the Klingon Empire...The Praetor of the Romulan Star Empire...

...and the Captain of a Federation Starship...

Offline F9thRyker

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #62 on: March 22, 2006, 08:34:46 pm »
In other news, Admiral Kirk suffered a strange regressive effect today when he encountered a clone of Khan - these effects are the first to be witnessed in deep space...



:D


The four most powerful men in the galaxy:

The President of the United Federation of Planets...
The Chancellor of the Klingon Empire...The Praetor of the Romulan Star Empire...

...and the Captain of a Federation Starship...

Offline F9thRyker

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #63 on: March 23, 2006, 05:19:59 pm »

Officially, Centurus isnt part of the 9th Fleet anymore. For the record, I will state that while he was with us, he remarked to several members of the fleet, including myself, about how great a model the Chabot was, but that as it was designed to be something just used for SFC - namely a kitbash - the model itself did not stand up to close scrutiny.

To this end, he came to the Fleet about creating a new model, of the exact (or as close as possible) type and configuration of the original, but with a much higher level of detail. Specifics here Im not sure of, but I believe it was intented for high-quality rendering work, as well as use in Bridge Commander.


Just a little clarification here, you'll have to forgive me. It seems like a lifetime ago now, but just to set the record straight- I was the one who approached Centurus, not the other way around, to do a new Chabot model in the beginning.

The existing one, as I said, was a good model, but didnt stand up to close scrutiny when enlarged or rendered in hi-res. Since Centurus had done some stellar work with the Constitution Mk 6 and the TNG Akula models, I felt that he was the best man for the job and, looking at his early WIPs, they looked (and still do) look stunning.

Thanks for your attention, and I apologize for any confusion.



The four most powerful men in the galaxy:

The President of the United Federation of Planets...
The Chancellor of the Klingon Empire...The Praetor of the Romulan Star Empire...

...and the Captain of a Federation Starship...

Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #64 on: March 29, 2006, 02:11:26 am »
Quote
With all due respect, I refuse to rename the ship.


You know, I would have thought that a simple request would have been honored. I guess not.

Can I do anything to stop it?

No. Again, it is nothing more than a model for a video game.

The attitude, though, is nausating to me at best.

For those who do not understand where I am coming from - I ask you to put your self in my shoes for a moment. There is a very good reason why I asked for a simple name change. This used to be a common, well understood practice among modelers and modders a like to honor.

No more. I suppose.

call it what you want to, but its not the chabot.

thanks.

Have a Question on this one are you talking about the name on the ship? (would be more than Happy to do this one, Registries are esy to do)
or Calling it a different Class? (out of my control not the one releasing it)
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #65 on: March 31, 2006, 12:16:34 am »
So here are some WIP shots just to help you have a empty stomache for dinner time!
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline ModelsPlease

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #66 on: March 31, 2006, 12:55:37 am »
Ummm GAFY?  What ship is that ????? It doesn't look like the Chabot I know  :huh:

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Offline Centurus

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #67 on: March 31, 2006, 01:59:28 am »
Hmmm.....I kinda like it.  I need to get someone to make a duplicate of the original Chabot secondary hull, with all the mesh errors corrected, or at least get the original one fixed.  :-D
The pen is truly mightier than the sword.  And considerably easier to write with.


Offline ModelsPlease

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #68 on: March 31, 2006, 11:26:07 am »
Hmmm.....I kinda like it.  I need to get someone to make a duplicate of the original Chabot secondary hull, with all the mesh errors corrected, or at least get the original one fixed.  :-D


Was this the varient F_W was working on ?

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Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #69 on: March 31, 2006, 01:04:18 pm »
Hmmm.....I kinda like it.  I need to get someone to make a duplicate of the original Chabot secondary hull, with all the mesh errors corrected, or at least get the original one fixed.  :-D


Was this the varient F_W was working on ?

No this is the orginal model with TMP styled textures on it. The one I am putting below is more or less where you guys were orginally going with the project before I got involved. Again it is still the orginal model with texture changes. All these are just for Ideas and not high quality work on the textures themselves, it was just to see the basic layouts. All the textures were basically things I had on hand laying around with minor changes. None of these are for release they are just for discussion purposes. The model that was retextured for release is not fully completeed yet, i am waiting on a new *.mod file with the mapping and mesh errors fixed for a final review.

So here is what you orginally looked like the direction the ship was going to take.
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #70 on: March 31, 2006, 11:09:23 pm »
So no discussions  :huh:

Oh well was wondoring what ppl though or input. Cent and MP know what the ship looks like for the release one but no one has anything to say for ideas or ships in general for what should be for where?
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline Centurus

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #71 on: March 31, 2006, 11:23:59 pm »
I think what I need you to do is do another texture of the original Chabot, a modest retexture, which retains the feel of the original, just making her look sharper. 
The pen is truly mightier than the sword.  And considerably easier to write with.


Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #72 on: April 01, 2006, 12:33:44 am »
I don't know was never fond of the escape capsules all over the ship in easy to target under protected areas
You figure a More Connie and one Excelsior verson would have appealed to someone, well other than me.
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline ModelsPlease

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #73 on: April 01, 2006, 11:03:49 am »
So no discussions  :huh:

Oh well was wondoring what ppl though or input. Cent and MP know what the ship looks like for the release one but no one has anything to say for ideas or ships in general for what should be for where?

Ok now I know what's going on LOL. For a minute I was confused  :P. I'm not fond of TMP style textures on an obviously TNG ship. Just because you have a TNG style hull texture on it doesn't mean you have to have the escape pods everywhere. If ya don't like 'em don't add 'em  ;).

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Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #74 on: May 25, 2006, 02:39:30 am »
Not to bring this one up from the Dead but...

The ship has finished most of the corrections and alterations
Many thanks to those that got us through this stage  ;D

So it will be time for conversion to mod files and nir soon.
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline ModelsPlease

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #75 on: May 27, 2006, 12:13:52 pm »
BUMP for release information.

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Offline F9th0mega

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #76 on: May 27, 2006, 02:35:58 pm »
Its worth the wait :D
Alternate universe:  Khan was banished for preserving the peace. The Genesis device was really a super weapon and kirk had planned to use it on the klingons. Chekov found the Botany Bay and khan hijakced and killed the evil reliant crew in an effort to destroy the genesis device.    Ahh i love it :D The alternate universe rocks.


Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #77 on: May 27, 2006, 04:01:19 pm »
the nice thing is the SFC 3 version is done the SFC 2 version he has the plans and spects for, the BC version might be the one that takes the longest and it was planned as a all at once release. As always birthing is on its own time table and never goes by the plan.
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.

Offline Centurus

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #78 on: May 27, 2006, 06:36:51 pm »
Sorry for the delay.

The ship is finished, specs and HP for SFC3 finished, and I'm going to make a hardpoint for SFC2 to GAFY's diagrams. 

For personal reasons, I want to wait on the SFC release till the BC release. 

I would have sent the ship yesterday to CA, but I was having problems getting the ship to load into MS3D.  Had to do some creative work to the ship to get her into MS3D and then ported to BC.  When I see the CA guys on MSN, I'll be sending them the ship for scripting and hardpointing. 

I have respectfully asked our own well-known master of the grave to make some renders for the release of this ship to give her a proper send off. 

Please stay tuned for more information.
The pen is truly mightier than the sword.  And considerably easier to write with.


Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: WIP Chabot Refit....
« Reply #79 on: May 27, 2006, 09:43:50 pm »
We now have the SFC Versions completed!

So now it is down to the BC Conversion to be finished and sorted out, then it will be released.
People always said they wanted the government to listen to them and now the government is listening, taking notes and names...and coming to see you soon!

America-Not the land of the free anymore...
 Its the land of the freeloaders

Remember the axiom of big government bureaucrats: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. When, finally, under the crushing weight of taxes and regulation, it stops moving, subsidize it.