Topic: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams  (Read 3429 times)

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Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

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And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« on: July 21, 2014, 11:52:46 am »
http://www.dailytech.com/JJ+Abrams+Unveils+XWing+Starfighter+for+New+Star+Wars+Movie/article36253.htm

I didn't realize that the classic X-Wing needed changing...

I didn't mind the Vipers being changed so much (technically they were 'newer models', we still had a few 1980's era Vipers floating around in the new BSG franchise), and loved that the new BSG (re)introduced physics into their space dogfighting.  And certainly Star Wars has a variety of fighter designs.  Messing with the beloved X-Wing, though... maybe it'll grow on me but, not being a fan of theJJPrise, pardon my suspicion.

Offline Corbomite

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2014, 11:57:09 am »
Everything requires changing, otherwise all those people making all that money have no justification for having their jobs.

Offline Javora

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2014, 12:08:05 pm »
It's not like there wouldn't be changes to the design over the last 30 years.

Offline Vipre

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2014, 03:01:09 pm »
It is actually not a new design, it's a version of the original concept design, it could pass as a newer version though. Call it the T-86 X-Wing.


This painting of the dogfight in the Death Star trench was completed in November of 1975.
Ralph [McQuarrie] was quick to point out that all of the elements in this painting — the trench
surface, the TIE fighter, and the X-wing — were based on Joe Johnston’s concepts.
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Offline Javora

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2014, 04:06:46 pm »
Given what Vipre said, maybe JJ Abrams learned something after doing those Trek like movies.

Offline knightstorm

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2014, 05:36:22 pm »
JJ is a Star Warsfan who re-imagined Trek to appeal to Star Wars fans.  That's why it sucked.  JJ wars probably wouldn't be as bad, but I refuse to see anything he's involved in after what he did to Trek.  As for the fighter, more time has passed between episode 6 and 7 than between episodes 3 and 4.  I don't expect them to be flying the same fighters.

Offline Vipre

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2014, 05:43:32 pm »
My only dislike of the design is the suggestion by some of where the wing splits with the back half going up and the front down, like shears. It feels silly. Why not just stick to the concept.




Regarding Abrams learning something, I think it's just simpler...he's a Star Wars Fanboy. He might bend Trek over without the courtesy of lube but I doubt he'd go after his SW the same.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2014, 11:23:12 pm by Vipre »
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Offline Corbomite

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2014, 07:24:25 pm »
My only dislike of the design is the suggestion by some of where the wing splits (red line) with the back half going up and the front down, like shears. It feels silly. Why not just stick to the concept.

JJ has no concept of concept.

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2014, 08:27:00 am »
The comments on Dailytech hit on one point, i.e. why they don't like the new design.

That being that the original 4 intake design has four round pods, which are presumed to contain rotating turbines or some such.  It is also pointed out that you can hear the turbines whine in the X-wing cockpit.

While I'm no Star Wars tech expert (if there is such a thing), I could think of a couple of reasons  for turbine-style  intakes.  Collecting interstellar gas for fuel.  Rotating armatures which generate power for the lasers and shields.  I like the idea of a fusion of these two ideas, i.e. collecting and compressing  interstellar hydrogen to augment the fuel supply, with the thrusters on the back 'spinning up' the generators and turbine vanes contained in the round 'intake' pods to channel said gas into the thrusters, while also  powering up the weapons by rotating the dual purpose generator armatures/compression fans.

Well, in Abrams design, assuming the wings split in some fashion, well you can't really split an axial shaft into two shafts, at least not easily... which is what his intake design would imply.

Myself, if I were looking to design a new X-wing, I'd have angled the intakes, wings and other surfaces to reduce the radar cross section (stealth technology), while retaining the classix 'x' configuration of the design when the wings are swept open.  Part of me would also want to stick on some angular tails (think Grumman YF-23) that fold down/stow flat when not needed, but deploy for atmospheric use (when the Wings are not deployed in the 'x' config).  I'd also throw in some thrust vectoring nozzles just for fun. I'd also add a bit of a curve to the upper wing, to provide some aerodynamic lift.   But that's mainly the fighter jet fanboy in me speaking...

McQuarrie's design looks a little better, as the intakes do not imply rotating turbines...

Looking at Vipre's image post, I could see the wings perhaps deploying using the engine housings as the pivot ponts for the wings, i.e. Wings 'x' out using the axial center of the engine intake pods as their 'pivot point', rather than splitting the engine pods into two half moons/crossing at the centerline of the fuselage.  But that doesn't increase the distance between the four engine thrusters vertically.  If you note, when a 'classic' X-Wing has its wings fully extended, the four engine exhaust thrusters are deployed in a square configuration, hence allowing you to vary thrust to any one or two engines to jink/yaw in any direction more or less equally.  In a rectangular config, well up/down thrust variations aren't as effective in changing pitch as  side to side thrust variations are at changing yaw, due to the engines being closer to the horizontal axis.

Whomever designed the original X-Wing put some thought into the design, so color me skeptical, as I don't think that JJ's new version took all of this into account.  Until we see it' in operation' on the big or little screen, though, it's all speculation...
« Last Edit: July 22, 2014, 08:38:25 am by EschelonOfJudgemnt »

Offline Vipre

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Re: And so it begins... iconic X Wing changed by Abrams
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2014, 06:04:08 pm »
"Whomever designed the original X-Wing put some thought into the design"

Hate to break it to you but the whole "square configuration engine exhaust" thing is quite likely pure coincidence. Looking at the original compared to the concept, the reality is that was probably a side effect of changing the intakes from semi to full circles which necessitated a thickening of the rear of the fighter and pushed the exhausts farther apart at their start. They effectively start in their opened concept position and widen out as a result ending up in a square by chance.
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