Topic: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..  (Read 9952 times)

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Offline Pestalence_XC

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Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« on: February 06, 2005, 10:39:04 pm »
Microsoft Anti-Spyware Beta 1

i just tried the microsoft Anti-Spyware Beta 1 on my system.. it found 5 items on my system that Ad-Aware and Spybot didn't find..

anyhow, it found vx2.transponder browser plug in, flashget (2 different signatures), and netpumper (2 different signatures)...

Hopefully that takes care of some of my bandwidth shortage from my cable connection..

Spython, Ad-Aware, and Spybot has kept my system clean for the last few years.. now I am adding 1 more program into my lineup of keeping my system clean.. I suggest using at least the microsoft anti-spyware, Ad-Aware SE, and Spybot S&D to keep a system clean of Adware, Spyware, Trojans, Tracking Cookies, hijackers, unsafe ActiveX plugins, etc... each catches things the other ones don't..

Anyhow, for those of you who want to check it out.. you can DL it from :

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/default.mspx



Also for Microsoft recommended software to protect your system.. you can look here at :

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/downloads/default.mspx

notice that norton is not listed.. norton is considered by several programming companies to be a virus in itself.. I personally use Panda Internet Securities... I have been using it for years.. and to now find out it is a Microsoft recommended protection system, that makes me feel better as it has been tested by microsoft to work on Windows systems...

Anyhow just thought you should know..

"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Offline E_Look

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2005, 10:54:12 pm »
Pest, could you elaborate a bit more about Norton?

They USED to have such a rock solid, sterling rep.

Offline Pestalence_XC

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2005, 12:11:36 am »
Well several companies, such as PC magazine and PC World, have investigated norton and it's integration into a PC.. it burries itself into C:\Program Files\Symantic, c:\Program Files\Common, C:\Windows\System32, C:\Documents and Settings\All Users, C:\Documents and Settings\(Username), and other locations on the HDD, thus slowing system performance when it is being used as active scan while the system is running, dropping system performance by up to 30%.. It has also been recorded as itentifying some legitimate program files as Virus and deleting them, as such leaving the program inoperatable.. this includes some of the more obscure Microsoft published programs.. Plus the deep rooted Registry entries.. on some systems, it isn't so bat, but any program rooting a minimum of 10 registry folders (not the keys them selves.... Keys number much more) tends to be considered invasive..

On top of all that, Norton does not fully uninstall using Add\Remove programs..

if one wishes to step up to a newer or better AV scanner, you will have to manually delete the Symantic registry entries.. the norton registry entries, and all folders located on one's system prior to installing any other AV.. the method is so troublesome that it is designed to discourage anyone from uninstalling the invasive norton program so that people will re-install it in order to keep some protection on their system no matter what impact it has on their system...

Most other Anti-Virus company programs will uninstall almost completely using Add\Remove programs and will automatically uninstall the registry keys and *.dll files where norton will not..

Norton is not an actual virus, but it is reguarded as a Virus by several companies due to it's invasiveness on a system and the impact on system performance.

It took me over 2 hours to completely uninstall Norton System Securities 2k3 off my sisters computer just so that Panda Internet Securities could install...

When she decided to try AVG, Panda uninstalled in 7 Min without a problem one and AVG installed just fine...

then she decided to go back to Panda as their software had more to offer and protected her system against much more than AVG, the change back took less than a total of 15 min...

It depends on what people like to use, but i tend to go with performance sites because i am a system speed freak (without overclocking my system.. i don't like burning up my system)... After doing my own testing with norton and other AV's with my sisters system, I really noticed a performance drop when it was running norton... and the pain it was to uninstall.. it was not good... norton imbeds so deep in the registry, that even if you have a good registry cleaner like RegSupreme Pro, RegSupreme can not remove the Symantic or norton entries from the registry after norton is uninstalled.. the entries have to be manually removed..

to me that is just a bit too invasive and the performance hit of 11% on my sisters system due to norton, it really put me out..

Anyhow.. hope that this helps.
"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Offline Bonk

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2005, 02:38:41 am »
They do list Symantec (though I dislike Norton too). McAfee has given me troubles in the past too, though fewer.  I'll give the MS AntiSpyware Beta a try and see what it turns up that Ad-aware and Search and destroy do not.  ;)

edit: Well, I tried it out and my Ad-aware and Spybot S&D scans came up clean, MS's antispyware warned me that my legitimate TightVNC installation could be a threat if I was not aware of it. (I installed it) Other than that, it found nothing else. Interesting to have the option of "real-time" spyware detection - though I have it turned off, like my AV scanner.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2005, 03:14:11 am by Bonk »

Offline Capt. Mike

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2005, 07:14:51 am »
Thanks dude..it found three I didn't know of...as to Norton's, I will have to do some research

Mike
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Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2005, 09:33:26 am »
FYI All,

Pleasae keep in mind this IS a beta and can cause conflicts with unknown other software.

Jerry
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Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2005, 09:38:28 am »
LOL...I really get a kick out of the graphics. :multi:
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Offline Nemesis

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2005, 06:08:46 pm »
FYI All,

Pleasae keep in mind this IS a beta and can cause conflicts with unknown other software.

Jerry

Keep in mind that it also calls home and therefore counts as spyware as well. 
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Offline Bonk

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2005, 10:34:12 pm »
FYI All,

Pleasae keep in mind this IS a beta and can cause conflicts with unknown other software.

Jerry

Keep in mind that it also calls home and therefore counts as spyware as well. 

Even if you turn off its network reporting feature and unload the real-time scanner? (not running a software firewall to check on it...) It extemely unlikely to be installed without the users knowledge and therefore does not qualify as spyware, you know about it and can turn off its phone home feature... (I think - not actually confirmed). Not that I'm trying to defend microsoft, just into tech semantics.

Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2005, 11:54:46 pm »
FYI All,

Pleasae keep in mind this IS a beta and can cause conflicts with unknown other software.

Jerry

Keep in mind that it also calls home and therefore counts as spyware as well.

Incorrect.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2005, 10:28:34 am by toasty0 »
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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2005, 01:55:35 am »
 Thanks Pestalence i had 3 as well . I detest this garbage +1 for you.

Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2005, 10:29:32 am »
Thanks Pestalence i had 3 as well . I detest this garbage +1 for you.
agreed...a +1 for whatshisname. hehehehehe
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Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2005, 12:06:13 pm »
Jujst ran a comparission test of Ad Aware versus the MS beta. Both ran through 200 gigs of HDD storage at about the same time frame. Both found NO critical spyware or malware, but Ad Aware did find alert me to the following:



Not a big deal but it is info I appreciate getting. For now I think I'll continue to use BOTH apps.

Jerry
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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2005, 01:30:11 pm »
 The MS one caught a bad one again this morning that the other 2 missed.

 But untill they get all of the bugs out im going to stick to all 3 for a while as welll.

 Thanks again Pestalence!!!!!

Offline Nemesis

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2005, 09:07:09 pm »
Keep in mind that it also calls home and therefore counts as spyware as well.


Incorrect.


Just to clarify here toasty are you saying that the program does not call home or that in spite of calling home it is not spyware?

The source of my information is in the following link and quoted below.

Quote
Apparently the tool is kind of spyware itself, since it reports back to HQ with data on what it has done on your machine. It's not that I care that Microsoft has a huge database of spyware infections and their relative popularity. It's just that I have yet to see what good any of this has done me. They never release the data. So what's the point? The company's argument that it collects this data so it can do a better job doesn't wash with me, given how secretive Microsoft always tends to be. For all I know they are going to push some spyware out there themselves and market it as foolproof.


You will note that it clearly states that the tool calls home to Microsoft.  Sounds like spyware to me.  Unless it asks first and does not report when I say no.  There have been other instances of "bugs" in such features from Microsoft such that they report no matter what you say.  The bugs were always fixed by patches. 
Do unto others as Frey has done unto you.
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Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2005, 09:36:20 am »
Keep in mind that it also calls home and therefore counts as spyware as well.


Incorrect.


Just to clarify here toasty are you saying that the program does not call home or that in spite of calling home it is not spyware?

The source of my information is in the following link and quoted below.

Quote
Apparently the tool is kind of spyware itself, since it reports back to HQ with data on what it has done on your machine. It's not that I care that Microsoft has a huge database of spyware infections and their relative popularity. It's just that I have yet to see what good any of this has done me. They never release the data. So what's the point? The company's argument that it collects this data so it can do a better job doesn't wash with me, given how secretive Microsoft always tends to be. For all I know they are going to push some spyware out there themselves and market it as foolproof.


You will note that it clearly states that the tool calls home to Microsoft.? Sounds like spyware to me.? Unless it asks first and does not report when I say no.? There have been other instances of "bugs" in such features from Microsoft such that they report no matter what you say.? The bugs were always fixed by patches.?


Nem,

The call home function can be turned off. It worked much like the Windows Update on XP.

Jerry
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Offline Nemesis

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2005, 07:41:56 pm »
Nem,

The call home function can be turned off. It worked much like the Windows Update on XP.

Jerry

I haven't tried the software so I can't say. 

Does the program clearly tell you that it will call home and indicate how to turn it off?  Does the turn off actually work?  If it  requires you to know about the call home feature and then look hard to turn it off then I would still call it spyware. 
Do unto others as Frey has done unto you.
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Offline Pestalence_XC

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2005, 09:34:36 pm »
Nem,

The call home function can be turned off. It worked much like the Windows Update on XP.

Jerry



I haven't tried the software so I can't say.

Does the program clearly tell you that it will call home and indicate how to turn it off? Does the turn off actually work? If it requires you to know about the call home feature and then look hard to turn it off then I would still call it spyware.

The call home is easily disabled when you go into the configuration settings located in tools button..

no one anti-spyware program will detect everything.. Spybot Search & Destroy and Adaware SE work great when ran together.. Spybot will remove usage tracks for your software as well as find maleware and spyware, Adaware works great in removing invalid MRU files , tracking cookies, and trojans... now using Microsoft Anti-spyware checks Active X and files deeper than most Anti-Spyware programs and as such it can detect items that Spybot and Adaware may not recognize as of yet since microsoft has a much bigger database than either Adaware or Spybot have combined...

The call home is designed into the Beta version in order to check for causing system crashing or to help debug the program in the event the program crashes itself.. but it can be disabled in the program's config settings.. as well as automatic updates can be disabled and so forth.. it can be operated completely manually.. Anyhow, the choice is yours, however as you can see by other people here that it is detecting items that Adaware and Spybot are not detecting...

Is it perfect... heck no, it is Beta and it is microsoft, so what you expect, but in the mean time, it is doing it's purpose in finding items that should not be operating on your system... Yes other companies are making trojans to hit Micorsoft's program, but look at whythey are doing it.. companies have made trojans to spiff Adaware and Spybot, some even completely corrupt spybot.. now that microsoft has a program that will detect the spyware that has been spoofing Adware and Spybot, companies are threatened in their spyware apps.. and so they are now trying to target Microsoft because they have lost a lot of data gathering trojans being detected now.... in otherwords, microsoft's Anti-spyware program is working correctly and Trojan makers are threatened..

it is logical progress.. they now have to create a program that disables microsoft's program in order to reinfect your system.... sounds like Microsoft hit a few companies pretty hard.
"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Offline toasty0

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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2005, 09:40:11 pm »
Nem,

The call home function can be turned off. It worked much like the Windows Update on XP.

Jerry

I haven't tried the software so I can't say. 

Does the program clearly tell you that it will call home and indicate how to turn it off?  Does the turn off actually work?  If it  requires you to know about the call home feature and then look hard to turn it off then I would still call it spyware. 
Yes, both during installation and any time there after as Pesty pointed out.
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Re: Concerning those who have Ad-Aware and Spybot..
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2005, 03:45:44 pm »
 

I beat a virus/malware infestation yesterday that was the worst I have ever seen.  Installed by the owner's teenage son downloading porn, I think, but I finally had to do it with my new bootable CD that runs WinXP off the CD drive & a RAMdisk.

UBCD4Win creation instructions are available here:  http://www.nu2.nu/pebuilder/ if anyone's interested in making one of these yourselves.  You'll need your own version of Windows, but trust me when I say THIS THING is DaBOMB!

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