Topic: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away  (Read 7238 times)

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Offline Stormbringer

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Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« on: April 25, 2007, 09:16:23 am »

http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/space/0....ap/index.html



Quote:
Scientists find most Earth-like planet yet

WASHINGTON (AP) -- European astronomers have found the most Earth-like planet outside our solar system, and here's what it might be like to live there:

The "sun" wouldn't burn brightly. It would hang close, large and red in the sky, glowing faintly like a charcoal ember. And it probably would never set if you lived on the sunny side of the planet.

You could have a birthday party every 13 days because that's how fast this new planet circles its sun-like star. But watch the cake -- you'd weigh a whole lot more than you do on Earth.

You might be able to keep your current wardrobe. The temperature in this alien setting will likely be a lot like Earth's -- not too hot, not too cold.

And that "just right" temperature is one key reason astronomers think this planet could conceivably house life outside our solar system. It's also as close to Earth-sized as telescopes have ever spotted. Both elements make it the first potentially habitable planet besides Earth or Mars.

Astronomers who announced the discovery of the new planet Tuesday say this puts them closer to answering the cosmic question: Are we alone?

"It's a significant step on the way to finding possible life in the universe," said University of Geneva astronomer Michel Mayor, one of 11 European scientists on the team that found the new body. "It's a nice discovery. We still have a lot of questions."

There's still a lot that is unknown about the new planet, which could be deemed inhospitable to life once more is learned about it. But as galaxies go, it's practically a neighbor. At only 120 trillion miles away, the red dwarf star that this planet circles is one of the 100 closest to Earth.

The results of the discovery have not been published but have been submitted to the journal Astronomy and Astrophysics.

Alan Boss, who works at the Carnegie Institution of Washington where a U.S. team of astronomers competed in the hunt for an Earth-like planet, called it "a major milestone in this business."

The planet was discovered by the European Southern Observatory's telescope in La Silla, Chile, which has a special instrument that splits light to find wobbles in different wavelengths. Those wobbles can reveal the existence of other worlds.

What they revealed is a planet circling the red dwarf star, Gliese 581. Red dwarfs are low-energy, tiny stars that give off dim red light and last longer than stars like our sun. Until a few years ago, astronomers didn't consider these stars as possible hosts of planets that might sustain life.

The discovery of the new planet, named 581 c, is sure to fuel studies of planets circling similar dim stars. About 80 percent of the stars near Earth are red dwarfs.

The new planet is about five times heavier than Earth, and gravity there would be 1.6 times as strong as Earth's. Its discoverers aren't certain if it is rocky like Earth or if its a frozen ice ball with liquid water on the surface. If it is rocky like Earth, which is what the prevailing theory proposes, it has a diameter about 11/2 times bigger than our planet. If it is an iceball, as Mayor suggests, it would be even bigger.

Based on theory, 581 c should have an atmosphere, but what's in that atmosphere is still a mystery and if it's too thick that could make the planet's surface temperature too hot, Mayor said.

However, the research team believes the average temperature to be somewhere between 32 and 104 degrees and that set off celebrations among astronomers.

Until now, all 220 planets astronomers have found outside our solar system have had the "Goldilocks problem." They've been too hot, too cold or just plain too big and gaseous, like uninhabitable Jupiter.

The new planet seems just right -- or at least that's what scientists think.

"This could be very important," said NASA astrobiology expert Chris McKay, who was not part of the discovery team. "It doesn't mean there is life, but it means it's an Earth-like planet in terms of potential habitability."

Eventually astronomers will rack up discoveries of dozens, maybe even hundreds of planets considered habitable, the astronomers said. But this one -- simply called "c" by its discoverers when they talk among themselves -- will go down in cosmic history as No. 1.

Besides having the right temperature, the new planet is probably full of liquid water, hypothesizes Stephane Udry, the discovery team's lead author and another Geneva astronomer. But that is based on theory about how planets form, not on any evidence, he said.

"Liquid water is critical to life as we know it," co-author Xavier Delfosse of Grenoble University in France, said in a statement. "Because of its temperature and relative proximity, this planet will most probably be a very important target of the future space missions dedicated to the search for extraterrestrial life. On the treasure map of the Universe, one would be tempted to mark this planet with an X."

Other astronomers cautioned it's too early to tell whether there is water.

"You need more work to say it's got water or it doesn't have water," said retired NASA astronomer Steve Maran, press officer for the American Astronomical Society. "You wouldn't send a crew there assuming that when you get there, they'll have enough water to get back."

The new planet's star system is a mere 20.5 light years away, making Gliese 581 one of the 100 closest stars to Earth. It's so dim, you can't see it without a telescope, but it's somewhere in the constellation Libra, which is low in the southeastern sky during the mid-evening in the Northern Hemisphere.

Even so, Maran noted, "We don't know how to get to those places in a human lifetime."

But, oh, the view, if you could. The planet is 14 times closer to the star it orbits. Udry figures the red dwarf star would hang in the sky at a size 20 times larger than our moon. And it's likely, but still not known, that the planet doesn't rotate, so one side would always be sunlit and the other dark.

Two teams of astronomers, one in Europe and one in the United States, have been racing to be the first to find a planet like 581 c outside the solar system.

The European team looked at 100 different stars using a tool called HARPS (High Accuracy Radial Velocity for Planetary Searcher) to find this one planet, said Xavier Bonfils of the Lisbon Observatory, one of the co-discoverers.

Much of the effort to find Earth-like planets has focused on stars like our sun with the challenge being to find a planet the right distance from the star it orbits. About 90 percent of the time, the European telescope focused its search more on sun-like stars, Udry said.

A few weeks before the European discovery earlier this month, a scientific paper in the journal Astrobiology theorized a few days that red dwarf stars were good candidates.

"Now we have the possibility to find many more," Bonfils said.
 


from another source:

http://www.netwhatever.com/astrodownunder/

An Earth-like planet in the “habitable zone” of another star was discovered, according to an announcement earlier today by a team of scientists from the European Southern Observatory. The planet orbits the star Gliese 581, a red dwarf located 20.5 light years away, in the constellation Libra.

So it is 20.5 light years away, has approxiamtely 1.6 Gs and an average temperature of from 30 degrees to 104 degrees farenheit.  wooT! let's go! or at least sent a M2P2 propelled probe!

Offline E_Look

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2007, 11:44:21 am »
 :huh:

I read in one article that it has an sunny side... so by necessity also a dark side??

Offline Lieutenant_Q

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2007, 12:03:24 pm »
Could you imagine the geological instability of such a planet?  Being that close to its star?
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Offline E_Look

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2007, 12:17:23 pm »
Is that necessarily true?

Offline Lieutenant_Q

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2007, 01:41:56 pm »
Very Likely.  There are other factors involved of course.  Plate Tectonics are the biggest one.  It's possible that there are no plates (and if its an ice planet then of course there are no plates) or very few plates that would limit the instability to a small percentage of the planet.  Its hard to tell if the proximity will affect it at all, but it seems likely given what happens to Earth when there is a slight increase in external gravitational forces (planetary alignments).

Of course the easiest way to tell for certain is to get a good thorough survey of Mercury and see what happens on that planet.  To my knowledge we haven't launched but one or two probes in that direction.

But, now that we've found a potentially habitable planet, and one that's relatively close too.  It's time to start working on a viable interplanetary craft.  Once we get that working, (using recent technological discoveries as an example) it should snowball fast enough into a ship that could be capable of near relativistic speeds within MY lifetime. (I'm only 26)  If we can get there in 25 or 30 years, I dare say we go for it.
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Offline E_Look

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2007, 03:02:42 pm »
I see.  But I was just wondering what its orbital speed is and whether that does not counteract any geological instability arising from solar gravitation.

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2007, 05:07:46 pm »
That article missed some interesting facts (1st link - 2nd link).  Not 1 but 3 planets have been found in that system.  One (581b) is Neptune sized and is the closest to its sun the 3rd (581d) is 8 times the Earths mass and is further out.  So that adds 2 more non gas giant planets to the list of extra solar planets.

Without having calculated anything I would say that 581b is close enough to 581c to cause orbital variances sufficient that it is unlikely to have been in the "life zone" around its M2.5 class sun for long enough for life to develop.
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2007, 06:04:10 pm »
:huh:

I read in one article that it has an sunny side... so by necessity also a dark side??


they assume it being so close to the star that it would be tidally lock. but we don't know that for sure.

Offline S'Raek

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2007, 09:11:53 pm »
Good stuff!  This kind of thing does get me a bit excited, it only makes sense that there will be other planets out there.  Other life is another story though.  Too bad we have no way of getting there, and don't seem to be heading in the direction of having a way any time soon either. 

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2007, 09:17:07 pm »


Good to see you back Stormy.


Earth like eh.   They have oil?   ;)


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Offline S'Raek

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2007, 06:41:32 am »
I'd be more interested in seeing unbroken tracks of forest.  It always stirs my imagination when I think back to when America was settled (by those pesky Europeans at least) and how it was almost total forest from the ocean to the river. 

I think if someone came up to me and said I could leave tomorrow to see this place I would give it serious consideration.  (I have a family I love so I probably wouldn't but I'd sure think about it!  lol) 

Again, I hope they figure out how to learn more about this planet and others like it when they are found too. 

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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2007, 07:13:06 am »


Good to see you back Stormy.


Earth like eh.   They have oil?   ;)




TY  :). Dunno about oil ;)

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2007, 07:23:14 am »
I'd be more interested in seeing unbroken tracks of forest.  It always stirs my imagination when I think back to when America was settled (by those pesky Europeans at least) and how it was almost total forest from the ocean to the river. 

I think if someone came up to me and said I could leave tomorrow to see this place I would give it serious consideration.  (I have a family I love so I probably wouldn't but I'd sure think about it!  lol) 

Again, I hope they figure out how to learn more about this planet and others like it when they are found too. 

They are developing satellite telescopes that can resolve biological signatures from the spectra of exo planets atmospheres. Things like isotopic ratios, the signature of clorophyl and so on. and with certain advanced propulsion schemes it is concievable to get a probe there in less than a life time. do a google on M2P2 propulsion, magbeam plasma propulsion and i don't remeber the exact term but had to do with Einstein's relativity and certain trajectories from an ordinary star. the upshot of the last one was a sort of fractional extra boost to travel time for not much energy input. kind of like a warp corridor. small but noticeable and adds up over stellar distances.

but M2P2 is the most likely to be done in the near term. prototypes have been built and tested.

Offline S'Raek

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2007, 10:18:34 am »
Sounds like I need to hit the Powerball so I can fund one of these things!  lol

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Offline E_Look

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2007, 11:00:04 am »
Do us a favor.  Go and discover warp drive first.  Even SFC took three tries to get it, so get started!

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2007, 11:12:49 am »
Whoa...people, we need to start a little smaller than that.  Lets get a viable interplanetary craft first.  Trying to go from space capsules (essentially Life boats) to Warp Ships?  There's at least one step in between that we need to tackle first.
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2007, 12:35:25 pm »
Whoa...people, we need to start a little smaller than that.  Lets get a viable interplanetary craft first.  Trying to go from space capsules (essentially Life boats) to Warp Ships?  There's at least one step in between that we need to tackle first.



That is very true so... let's design one using things we have seen recently in science articles.



 i vote for a design with at least ten M2P2 modules as the primary drive for the outbound leg of the trip and 2 of the fusion reactors from the improved Z machine configured as a rocket with induction taps for ships electrical power. and at least 4  Ytrium quantum batteries as emergency power. a battery of eight advanced h20 cycle fuel cells for atmospheric life support water and waste management. with stored back up allowing for normal loss and any damage or accidents. bulkheads will have hydrogen impregnated polymer layers for emergency radiation protection but main protection will be the plasma bubble created by the M2P2 engine array.

even though trip times in the vicinity of our solar system will be very quick there will be either a centrifugal gravity simulation module or due to recent discoveries; perhaps aset of  spinning supercondcutor artificial gravity arrays in the inner hull and decks with a normal upward orientation.

forward armor will be angled layers of erbium diboride alternated with layers of liquid polymer impact hardening gel and self healing third generation memory alloys or polymers and pressurized expanding foam puncture sealant material.

for additional forward protection from microparticles and up to 10 meter diameter sized debrise will be both a 2nd generation battery of ABL class  lasers and if the synthetic gravity thing turns out then a gravitational deflector.

the design for the ship is linear such that it can easily be reffited with any of these technologies as they become available to include any attempts at alcubierre drive systems at some distant time.


we know the M2P2 thing will work. so it is a gimme to be on the ship the rest have varying degrees of possibility of becoming real technology. though the quantum batteries are also real and the z machine fusion reactors, fuel cells, erbium diboride, and the rest of the armor stuff are also real.
but the use of the z machine reactor as a rocket is not mature nor is the gravity syste other than the centrifugal one. the 2nd generation ABL system is just a gleam in the engineers eyes at this time and the alcubierre type drive system not even that yet.

but the design of the ship is such that it is ready for any and all of these and can still be made to work without any of them. imagine the rough shape of the correlian corvette blocade runner, diplomatic courier ship from the Starwars movies and you would have the rough shape i think would be easiest to do near term ("near term" and "easy" both being relative terms here ;)  ).

the M2P2 drive engines would be two on the outside three more then the two fusion motors then three more M2P2 with two more on the outside of that.
if we have to resort to centrifugal gravity then there are three options one is a collar around the section just fore of the engine section. another is a rotating barrel in the forward bow. or a third is to have gravity only under accelleration by orienting the decks perpendicular to the forward axis of the ship.  (imagine the ship were a cylydrical sky scraper in space with the roof of the skyscraper being the front end of the ship in this case.)



Offline Lieutenant_Q

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2007, 01:05:44 pm »
Never heard of the M2P2 drive before, you have a link to it?

You and I seem to have the same design ideas though.  Which tells me I'm not totally insane. :)

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163363849.0.html
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2007, 01:40:59 pm »
Never heard of the M2P2 drive before, you have a link to it?

You and I seem to have the same design ideas though.  Which tells me I'm not totally insane. :)

http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php/topic,163363849.0.html
not insane. ;D

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« Last Edit: April 26, 2007, 02:01:50 pm by Stormbringer »

Offline Lieutenant_Q

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2007, 01:58:28 pm »
Interesting.  Back to the age of sail essentially.  Amazing how things come full circle.
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2007, 02:03:54 pm »
Interesting.  Back to the age of sail essentially.  Amazing how things come full circle.

i added a couple of links. sail. and like sailing it is possible to tack against the wind here too. but i think the fusion engine would provide thrust if needed outside a star system. but remember no friction means once accelerated the thing needs no thrust except for manuevering.

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2007, 06:35:36 pm »


Good to see you back Stormy.


Earth like eh.   They have oil?   ;)




TY  :). Dunno about oil ;)



Well let's hop to it mister and find out.  There's a brand new world out there just waiting to be plundered.

I love being a capitalist.   8)


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Offline E_Look

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2007, 10:13:19 pm »
Seriously, I'd rather suspect that iron ore, rare metals and minerals would be stuff that possible future space freighters would haul back to Ea... uh, Io Colony.

Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #24 on: April 26, 2007, 10:41:25 pm »
Seriously, I'd rather suspect that iron ore, rare metals and minerals would be stuff that possible future space freighters would haul back to Ea... uh, Io Colony.

Don't know about iron ore but other strategic minerals. titanium and rare earths... and of course diamonds and gold. and dilithium. don't forget dilithium... :P

Offline E_Look

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #25 on: April 26, 2007, 10:54:17 pm »
I think for the foreseeable future, even if or especially if we have "warp drive", Man will still use mucho amounts of iron.

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #26 on: April 26, 2007, 11:04:26 pm »
I think for the foreseeable future, even if or especially if we have "warp drive", Man will still use mucho amounts of iron.
true but so far as i know we are not in any shortage of iron for the foreseeable future, but we definitely need rare earths and other elements.

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #27 on: April 27, 2007, 01:28:37 pm »
In the year 2015 they will launch a telescope named Darwin, it will be able to analyse the composition of the atmospheres of planets in orbit around far away stars.

This should shed a lot of light on if life is out there.  They say life leaves a fingerprint in the atmosphere of planets.

Ya like you have tell that to us,....  burn it, burn it, burn it,....  Getting warm around here eh ?


Darwin info site:
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #28 on: April 27, 2007, 02:13:27 pm »
In the year 2015 they will launch a telescope named Darwin, it will be able to analyse the composition of the atmospheres of planets in orbit around far away stars.

This should shed a lot of light on if life is out there.  They say life leaves a fingerprint in the atmosphere of planets.

Ya like you have tell that to us,....  burn it, burn it, burn it,....  Getting warm around here eh ?


Darwin info site:
http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/area/index.cfm?fareaid=28


actually the signs we expect based on the one example we have and have more to do with isotpic distribution rations of normal O2, carbon, nitorgen and so on to radioactive variants. chlorophyl can also be detected at stellar distances by similar means. so *if* life on other planets prduce similar isotopic ratios then we can detect carbon based life. but this would not necessarily detect life not sufficiently similar to our own. say if there are alternate evolutionary paths to life in silicon or a third substance hypothesiszed to be chemically flexible enough to create biology on which (i cannot remember the name of) then i don't think those forms of life would be detectable through the same signatures.

Offline Skaren

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #29 on: April 27, 2007, 03:31:41 pm »
I agree Storm,.. in fact our own Earth started with a very different life.  Oxygen was killer to it.  As other creatures (algae, I think) arose that that algae gave off O2 as a waste product, and changed the atmosphere into such a state that it killed off the original inhabitants.

And who says man cannot change the atmosphere,...  must not know Earths ancient ancient history.

I had not known they will be able to pick out stuff to that level of detail.  To think this is only the first generation of this type of telescope.  Image in a hundred years when the space based beasts can see a thousand times more atmospheric detail.  Hell they may be able to pick up on cow farts  ;D
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #30 on: April 27, 2007, 05:06:44 pm »
I agree Storm,.. in fact our own Earth started with a very different life.  Oxygen was killer to it.  As other creatures (algae, I think) arose that that algae gave off O2 as a waste product, and changed the atmosphere into such a state that it killed off the original inhabitants.

And who says man cannot change the atmosphere,...  must not know Earths ancient ancient history.

I had not known they will be able to pick out stuff to that level of detail.  To think this is only the first generation of this type of telescope.  Image in a hundred years when the space based beasts can see a thousand times more atmospheric detail.  Hell they may be able to pick up on cow farts  ;D

 I recall a article on detection of the signature of chlorophyl a while back. notthat they had butthat the next generations of telescopes could. but as to isotpes and stuff pertaining to the analysis of gases at such distances... they already can to a very limited degree with what we have now. only if the circumstances are right. the next generation should increase that capability.

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #31 on: April 27, 2007, 06:44:47 pm »
i think goal #1 should be first colonize mars before we tink about colonizing another planet 20 light years away.  Simply put we need the expiernce.  so in my book Phase one is colonize the moon and mars.  This allows us to build a foundation of knowledge that we can build off of.  It also allows us an opprutunity to see if we develop any tech break throughs through neccesity (hey its the mother of all invention, and them mars and lunar colonits will have some things that will need to be solved).  Phase 2 could be more colonizing, or if we are ready to take the big leap then go for this planet.
Rob

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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #32 on: April 28, 2007, 02:54:01 am »
i think goal #1 should be first colonize mars before we tink about colonizing another planet 20 light years away.  Simply put we need the expiernce.  so in my book Phase one is colonize the moon and mars.  This allows us to build a foundation of knowledge that we can build off of.  It also allows us an opprutunity to see if we develop any tech break throughs through neccesity (hey its the mother of all invention, and them mars and lunar colonits will have some things that will need to be solved).  Phase 2 could be more colonizing, or if we are ready to take the big leap then go for this planet.

while there may be other good reasons for doing Mars first expeerience in colonization is probably not one of them. if our telescope spying and or probes detect a breathable atmosphere coupled with a magnetic field/ionosphere then the difference between the two are so great that Mars is like colonising hard vacuum and the other is like colonizing australia.

Mars should be done. not least of reasons is that it is much closer. but it is likely that the only knowledge Mars would impart appliocable to colonizing a more earth like planet would be getting there and psychology and logistics.

Offline Nemesis

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #33 on: April 28, 2007, 07:17:45 pm »
Colonizing an "Earth like" planet may have issues that are usually glossed over. 

1/ incompatible biochemistry. Even if it has a basis in amino acids they don't have to be the same ones or can be isomers of them.  This leaves us unable to eat native foods and even our plants may not be able to be grown.  The local foods could even be toxic.

2/ Assume an identical chemical basis.  How about allergies?  There could easily be ubiquitous biological materials that are universal allergens to earthly life.  Remember that allergies range from annoying to fatal.

3/ If we can live there and eat the local foods we might easily and accidentally import (or export to Earth) a disease or vermin that can just destroy much of the local ecology.  Imagine for example a mouse that earthly predators just ignore reproducing without limit and destroying the ecology of the Earth.  Australia has had problems like this.

I'm sure that there are more but these are just off the top of my head.
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #34 on: April 28, 2007, 07:38:36 pm »
Colonizing an "Earth like" planet may have issues that are usually glossed over. 

1/ incompatible biochemistry. Even if it has a basis in amino acids they don't have to be the same ones or can be isomers of them.  This leaves us unable to eat native foods and even our plants may not be able to be grown.  The local foods could even be toxic.

2/ Assume an identical chemical basis.  How about allergies?  There could easily be ubiquitous biological materials that are universal allergens to earthly life.  Remember that allergies range from annoying to fatal.

3/ If we can live there and eat the local foods we might easily and accidentally import (or export to Earth) a disease or vermin that can just destroy much of the local ecology.  Imagine for example a mouse that earthly predators just ignore reproducing without limit and destroying the ecology of the Earth.  Australia has had problems like this.

I'm sure that there are more but these are just off the top of my head.
The primary considerations for colonization would be atmosphere, temperature and magnetic field and ionosphere. we would not send them there to rely on the local flora and fauna. they would take agricultural plants, animals and genetic samples or at least sequence maps. ifthe plants could not adapt to the native environment then self contained habitats would be constructed to provide the plants and animals a simulation of an earth environement. soil could be sterilized chemically altered and the inoculated with earth bacterial fungi and even earth worms. uv lighting could be used if the stars spectra was incorrect.

Offline Don Karnage

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #35 on: May 03, 2007, 10:12:51 am »
i heard of the planet but i taught it was 50 000 light years away?

anyway how old is it?

there might be no evolve life there or not like we know it?

or all the politician come from that planet, that would explain why are the so stupid  ;D (invasion plan)

Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #36 on: May 03, 2007, 01:22:24 pm »
i heard of the planet but i taught it was 50 000 light years away?

anyway how old is it?

there might be no evolve life there or not like we know it?

or all the politician come from that planet, that would explain why are the so stupid  ;D (invasion plan)

20.5 LY away. IIRC

Offline Fedman NCC-3758

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #37 on: May 03, 2007, 02:29:10 pm »



 :police:  Face it.  We are  alone.   :police:


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Offline Skaren

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #38 on: May 03, 2007, 03:29:00 pm »
Yep,...  we are alone

and furthermore,...   we are at the center of the universe, all other bodies in the heavens orbit us.  We are all there is.  I feel grand about myself and rather important,....

Oh wait that was 400 years ago.   


:rofl:
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Offline Fedman NCC-3758

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #39 on: May 03, 2007, 03:31:55 pm »


When the Borg contact you, please let the Dyna members know first.

Much appreciated.

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Offline Don Karnage

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #40 on: May 03, 2007, 03:43:10 pm »


When the Borg contact you, please let the Dyna members know first.

Much appreciated.



yea
but where will we hide?  :ufo:

Offline Fedman NCC-3758

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #41 on: May 03, 2007, 03:44:05 pm »


When the Borg contact you, please let the Dyna members know first.

Much appreciated.



yea
but where will we hide?  :ufo:


It's futile.   ;)


The Star Spangled Banner bring hither,
 O're Columbia's true sons let it wave.
May the wreaths they have won never wither,
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Offline Stormbringer

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #42 on: May 03, 2007, 05:40:30 pm »
Uh Oh.

http://space.newscientist.com/article/mg19426023.800-european-planet-hunters-on-brink-of-earthsized-prize.html

EUROPEAN planet hunters are stealing a march on their American rivals. After last week's discovery of a "habitable" extrasolar planet the mass of five Earths - the smallest yet found - European astronomers have had more good news. Their new space telescope, called COROT, is proving 10 times as sensitive as expected. The spacecraft seems sharp enough to detect planets as small as Earth, a task widely thought impossible in advance of the launch of NASA's Kepler telescope in October 2008.

The realisation came as astronomers analysed the first data beamed back from COROT, which launched on 27 December 2006. "We are no longer talking about just detecting super-Earths," says Malcolm Fridlund, COROT mission scientist at the European Space Agency (ESA). "We are talking about detecting Earths."


Offline Tus-XC

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Re: Earth like planet discovered 20 light years away
« Reply #43 on: May 07, 2007, 11:35:52 pm »
while there may be other good reasons for doing Mars first expeerience in colonization is probably not one of them. if our telescope spying and or probes detect a breathable atmosphere coupled with a magnetic field/ionosphere then the difference between the two are so great that Mars is like colonising hard vacuum and the other is like colonizing australia.

Mars should be done. not least of reasons is that it is much closer. but it is likely that the only knowledge Mars would impart appliocable to colonizing a more earth like planet would be getting there and psychology and logistics.

Actually that is exactly the reason why i would propose to a conlonization effort of mars first.  It is inhospitable to say the least, and exactly what we need to prepare.  I was always raised to prepare of the worst even if you knew it wouldn't happen.  A colony ship going that far away (a short distance on the galatic scale) has no recourse if an emergency were to befall its mission or forbid its final destination, whether it be some kind of ecological disastor on said planet that causes it to be in hospitable, or as nem put something as simple as allergies that would prevent us from even breathing unfilitered air or going outside without protective sealed garments. Such are the lessons we shall take from mars, a possible worst case scenario so to speak, preparation so that our colonists will have some expiernce to allow to them act in a manner in which to  perserve the mission and ultimately their lives.  Mars also lets us learn how to set up a colony with minimum logistics and minimum supplies for the mission at hand.  It also give us the knowledge we need before even thinking about colonizing a world far enough away that it would be impossible for us to peform any kind of rescue mission. Further we must have trained people who know what to do, and that training simply put can only come from expiernce, as no simulation is going to give them the breathe of knowledge neccesary to handle the variety of situations that will most likely befall them. 

So i would counter that all the lessons we would learn from mars perfectly applicable for any other colonization effort, and not just for the few reasons you listed.
Rob

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