Topic: Trek 11 Enterprise  (Read 18780 times)

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Offline Norsehound

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #40 on: November 12, 2008, 07:26:40 pm »
The secondary hull fix is ok- but where's the shuttlebay?

I think the nacelles are cool on their own. Were I a kitbasher, I'd be experimenting with them as alternative Phase-II engines.

Offline Just plain old Punisher

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #41 on: November 12, 2008, 07:29:02 pm »
Tis ugly.

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Offline Atolm-Rising

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #42 on: November 12, 2008, 07:35:28 pm »
You know...
I think by now, you guys should know how I feel about Trek in all its incarnations, and how I feel about new ideas in general.
that being said... I  have never felt, what I feel now, and that is disappointment and shame.  I have never felt That being a Trek fan would lump me with a group of the most close-minded people in the world.  I mean, Trek in any and all of its incarnations have always been about acceptence, and embracing of diverisity in all its forms.  It was, in a lot of ways Anti-Canonization.
Yet all we do is bitch about BS.  Its really all just silly.
How about, we not bash something until we have experienced it.  Is it really that hard?
I mean just WTF does the IDIC stand for?

I dunno, and on top of that, I don't really want to know, if it means me becoming a closed-minded person to new possibilities.
Now, if some of you take offence at this then fine, I appologize , but I am offended to read all these negative comments and prejudices about something that isn't even out yet.

Think about that.

Offline Don Karnage

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #43 on: November 12, 2008, 09:00:49 pm »
Silly people, I think they forgot to add in some details.

Here, I'll be nice and correct them for them.  :)



what's the red dot beside the deflector dish?

and just over the dish on the neck its look like a torpedo tube no?

Offline Centurus

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #44 on: November 12, 2008, 09:43:26 pm »
You know...
I think by now, you guys should know how I feel about Trek in all its incarnations, and how I feel about new ideas in general.
that being said... I  have never felt, what I feel now, and that is disappointment and shame.  I have never felt That being a Trek fan would lump me with a group of the most close-minded people in the world.  I mean, Trek in any and all of its incarnations have always been about acceptence, and embracing of diverisity in all its forms.  It was, in a lot of ways Anti-Canonization.
Yet all we do is bitch about BS.  Its really all just silly.
How about, we not bash something until we have experienced it.  Is it really that hard?
I mean just WTF does the IDIC stand for?

I dunno, and on top of that, I don't really want to know, if it means me becoming a closed-minded person to new possibilities.
Now, if some of you take offence at this then fine, I appologize , but I am offended to read all these negative comments and prejudices about something that isn't even out yet.

Think about that.

Open minded is liking Enterprise even with its faults.  Accepting this new ship as Kirk's Enterprise, no way.

*shudders*

Also, remember, open minded is a matter of perspective.

Think about that.
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Offline Greenvalv

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #45 on: November 12, 2008, 09:47:31 pm »
Also, remember, open minded is a matter of perspective.

Think about that.
But... one would have to be open minded to begin with in order to try to think of open mindedness as being a matter of perspective...
 
I think I just blew a fuse...  :drool:

Offline Centurus

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #46 on: November 12, 2008, 09:51:01 pm »
Also, remember, open minded is a matter of perspective.

Think about that.
But... one would have to be open minded to begin with in order to try to think of open mindedness as being a matter of perspective...
 
I think I just blew a fuse...  :drool:

And because I hate JJ's Bastard-prise makes me closed minded?  *opens Greenvalv's head and looks for the burnt out fuse and then replaces it with a Die Hard fuse*
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Offline Centurus

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #47 on: November 12, 2008, 09:57:20 pm »
My previous post wasn't direct directly at you Greenvalv, so in case you felt that way, I apologize.   :)
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Offline dragoon

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #48 on: November 12, 2008, 09:59:20 pm »
You know...
I think by now, you guys should know how I feel about Trek in all its incarnations, and how I feel about new ideas in general.
that being said... I  have never felt, what I feel now, and that is disappointment and shame.  I have never felt That being a Trek fan would lump me with a group of the most close-minded people in the world.  I mean, Trek in any and all of its incarnations have always been about acceptence, and embracing of diverisity in all its forms.  It was, in a lot of ways Anti-Canonization.
Yet all we do is bitch about BS.  Its really all just silly.
How about, we not bash something until we have experienced it.  Is it really that hard?
I mean just WTF does the IDIC stand for?

I dunno, and on top of that, I don't really want to know, if it means me becoming a closed-minded person to new possibilities.
Now, if some of you take offence at this then fine, I appologize , but I am offended to read all these negative comments and prejudices about something that isn't even out yet.

Think about that.

I agree Atolm.
It's not wanting to have the stigma of being classed as that kind of fan, that I don't say I like Trek. I can proudly show my NuBSG tattoo off, and talk of my unhealthy enjoyment of that show, but Trek.......

The die-hards can have their 700 hours+, and I'll always share my appreciation of that time with them, but i'll also have any extra hours of Trek that comes from the result of this film too.

From what I can tell, this film is making an effort to follow the positive message of Trek. And in the world we have at the moment, and the dark cinema and TV we've had to live with the last few years, I am looking forward to a more positive experience. All of the Canon etc, I'm happy to see that discarded... The male characters are still male, and the women are still women, they still have the same names, and are generally the same racial/nationality ( Sulu not included I guess )... That's good enough for me at this point.

I equate this whole thing with the uproar people had about Daniel Craig and Casino Royale... people spat venom at him and the film. Then it turned out to be bloody good, and DC is now my favourite Bond. I think things will go the same with this.

As a side note.. George Takai is appearing on a reality show her in the UK starting next week called I'm a celebrity get me out of here.... and all of the media about the contestants starts talking of him and his Trek relations... and from those mentions, they then talk about JJ's Trek. So in the UK at least, it's getting some positive coverage across the board... It's even making BBC take notice.
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Offline GotAFarmYet?

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #49 on: November 12, 2008, 10:53:08 pm »
You know...
I think by now, you guys should know how I feel about Trek in all its incarnations, and how I feel about new ideas in general.
that being said... I  have never felt, what I feel now, and that is disappointment and shame.  I have never felt That being a Trek fan would lump me with a group of the most close-minded people in the world.  I mean, Trek in any and all of its incarnations have always been about acceptence, and embracing of diverisity in all its forms.  It was, in a lot of ways Anti-Canonization.
Yet all we do is bitch about BS.  Its really all just silly.
How about, we not bash something until we have experienced it.  Is it really that hard?
I mean just WTF does the IDIC stand for?

I dunno, and on top of that, I don't really want to know, if it means me becoming a closed-minded person to new possibilities.
Now, if some of you take offence at this then fine, I appologize , but I am offended to read all these negative comments and prejudices about something that isn't even out yet.

Think about that.

LOL

Why would I take offense to someone who is expressing their opinion?

Either way it goes I don't care about the movie the script or anything like that, I just think it is a ugly looking ship. Thats it plain and simple does it effect anything else, nope, at least not to me. I just think they could have done better as we have all seen better looking ships out there on the net. The Enterprise version looked fine and they should have gone with something inbetween it and the TOS one. The one they have there doesn't really fit for the look it has, this one looks like the TMP and TNG Enterprises were humping and the gene pool was a little to close, probably closer than the banjo kid in Deliverance.

They should have broken away completely, or done a better job for the ship design.
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Offline Lieutenant_Q

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #50 on: November 12, 2008, 11:17:40 pm »
I still say the fans are the reason trek has become how it is. ship has some nice touches but it doesn't stop the fact that all the moaning about canon caused this to happen


I have to disagree on this one.  Trek is what it is not because of the fans, but because after 32 days of material, they really have run out of material to put forth.  But there has been other things to explore, its just that those in charge aren't willing to explore it, but they are more than willing to rehash the old tired plots.  Look at Nemesis, the idea was basically to steal items from the most popular trek movie out there, TWoK.  But it wasn't done very well, and since there was no history between Picard and Shinzon, baring that they were really the same person, it seemed forced on the screen.  Not like Kirk and Khan at all.

DS9 was so successful, in my mind, because it explored, in depth, another culture.  Bajor, and its relations to the Cardassians.  How many of us would love to see Star Trek: Klingon, or Star Trek: Romulan.  A series that focused entirely on that culture in Star Trek.  The Klingon would be easier to do, since a lot of the Klingon back story already exists, as it was covered extensively in TNG and DS9.  But the Romulan would be a fresh new perspective.  You could rehash some of the same old plot lines because the Romulans, or Klingons, would resolve the problem differently, sometimes the resolution is just as important as the problem.   All it would take is a bit of creativity, and I think the show would be a success, certainly better than trying to "re-boot" the franchise.
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Offline JohanobesusII

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #51 on: November 13, 2008, 12:18:58 am »
You know...
I think by now, you guys should know how I feel about Trek in all its incarnations, and how I feel about new ideas in general.
that being said... I  have never felt, what I feel now, and that is disappointment and shame.  I have never felt That being a Trek fan would lump me with a group of the most close-minded people in the world.  I mean, Trek in any and all of its incarnations have always been about acceptence, and embracing of diverisity in all its forms.  It was, in a lot of ways Anti-Canonization.
Yet all we do is bitch about BS.  Its really all just silly.
How about, we not bash something until we have experienced it.  Is it really that hard?
I mean just WTF does the IDIC stand for?

I dunno, and on top of that, I don't really want to know, if it means me becoming a closed-minded person to new possibilities.
Now, if some of you take offence at this then fine, I appologize , but I am offended to read all these negative comments and prejudices about something that isn't even out yet.

Think about that.

Embracing diversity doesn't mean loving everything just because it exists.  One has every right to say, "that isn't Trek."  If you diverge too far from the established aesthetic, then it really isn't Star Trek anymore.  It's a new thing that is at best inspired by Star Trek.  That's not a bad thing in and of itself, but you should own up to what it is and isn't.  It isn't closed minded to ask that the established look and themes of Star Trek be respected.

I think what most people are upset about isn't that the design itself is awful, but that it is supposed to be the Enterprise.  Strangely Abrams himself summed it up well: "If you're going to do Star Trek there are many things you cannot change. The Enterprise is a visual touchstone for so many people. So if you’re going to do the Enterprise, it better look like the Enterprise, because otherwise, what are you doing?" 

There's nothing wrong with creating new ships and new technologies.  In fact it would be sad if science fiction in general were limited to the established canon of a few franchises.  This might be a great sci- movie, with a fun story and beautiful ships, but so far it doesn't look like Star Trek.  If Abrams wanted to create a really novel aesthetic and original characters, then he should have made a completely original story with no connection to Star Trek.  I would welcome a new sci- universe to learn about.  But Star Trek holds a special place in my heart.  Changing key elements just to be new feels like a betrayal.

Offline TheStressPuppy

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #52 on: November 13, 2008, 01:00:03 am »
We all knew a "Re-Boot" was coming. They tried to reboot trek with Enterprise, and it failed. Not because of the "Akiraprise". I happen to like the design but it didnt fit the era. Not for the fact that established canon was dismissed. It was supposed to be a re-boot remember?. Enterprise died from Bad writing, inept story telling, and cardboard cutout acting. Something the other shows for the most part did not suffer from. Manny Coto made a very valiant effort trying to revive Enterprise, but it was already too late. I could have accepted Enterprise as a reboot if it was made known that it was in fact a reboot.

I happened to like the new BSG. It IMHO is the way a reboot should be done. Very imaginative. Excellent storytelling, Excellent acting, and a nice twist to what we already knew from the original show.

Trek XI should be viewed like the BSG of trek. Young minds new ideas. Who knows the movie itself might turn out to be good. I am going to give it a chance.....

However i do not agree with this new Enterprise design. It totally threw me in shock. It looks nothing like the old girl at all.

Probably as much as the new Galactica looked only somewhat like the old. Same with the new TOS 1701. This enterprise looks just like a "downgrade" of the TMP ship. Now i agree to avoid the "cigar" style nacelles, but this nacelle design is a little too drastic. The secondary hull looks almost like the phase 2 concept model. I was a big advocate of "improving" the old TOS ship, but this is NOT quite what i had in mind. Then again this movie IS a Re-boot. Despite what JJ is saying this movie is all about re-inventing trek. It is not a bad design. Just for those of us that are used to seeing the original jefferies design this "new" ship is just a little hard to swallow.

Maybe if i saw the ship from different angles I can come to agree with it more, and from what i read the perspective in this view is very bad. Still i dont know. Like i said i am going to give the movie a chance like i did BSG. Who knows.




Offline Age

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #53 on: November 13, 2008, 02:20:44 am »
I will say this if this is indeed the ship as it was revealed to me on STG by one of our staff.I hope it get destroyed.I made a thread about this in the Holodeck.

Offline Rod ONeal

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #54 on: November 13, 2008, 04:25:57 am »
I'm just curious, does anyone know who did the model? It does look like another reboot of Gabe's, to me. What does anyone else think?

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Offline Pestalence_XC

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #55 on: November 13, 2008, 04:36:42 am »
We all knew a "Re-Boot" was coming. They tried to reboot trek with Enterprise, and it failed. Not because of the "Akiraprise". I happen to like the design but it didnt fit the era. Not for the fact that established canon was dismissed. It was supposed to be a re-boot remember?. Enterprise died from Bad writing, inept story telling, and cardboard cutout acting. Something the other shows for the most part did not suffer from. Manny Coto made a very valiant effort trying to revive Enterprise, but it was already too late. I could have accepted Enterprise as a reboot if it was made known that it was in fact a reboot.

I happened to like the new BSG. It IMHO is the way a reboot should be done. Very imaginative. Excellent storytelling, Excellent acting, and a nice twist to what we already knew from the original show.

Trek XI should be viewed like the BSG of trek. Young minds new ideas. Who knows the movie itself might turn out to be good. I am going to give it a chance.....

However i do not agree with this new Enterprise design. It totally threw me in shock. It looks nothing like the old girl at all.

Probably as much as the new Galactica looked only somewhat like the old. Same with the new TOS 1701. This enterprise looks just like a "downgrade" of the TMP ship. Now i agree to avoid the "cigar" style nacelles, but this nacelle design is a little too drastic. The secondary hull looks almost like the phase 2 concept model. I was a big advocate of "improving" the old TOS ship, but this is NOT quite what i had in mind. Then again this movie IS a Re-boot. Despite what JJ is saying this movie is all about re-inventing trek. It is not a bad design. Just for those of us that are used to seeing the original jefferies design this "new" ship is just a little hard to swallow.

Maybe if i saw the ship from different angles I can come to agree with it more, and from what i read the perspective in this view is very bad. Still i dont know. Like i said i am going to give the movie a chance like i did BSG. Who knows.




Going by your anaolgy

Original Battlestar Galactica (1979)



New Battlestar Galactica (2004)



As you can see, they kept the design of the ship almost identical, with a few changes on the surface of the hull.. Plus they didn't try to bump this off as a Prequil.. it was supposedly " Everything that is happening now has happened before and will happen again", in orhtwords,, history repeating itself (reincarnation theory of the Cylons playing out.. they even had the Original Viper Fighter and Original Cylons in the show).

This new trek is just a bastardation re-write of established canon.. Ship and Crew first (since when did Kirk take the Enterprise out of space dock in his junior year when Captain Robert April is the one who was supposedly to launch the Enterprise?)

example..

TOS Enterprise



and it is supposedly to have been originally built as



That just doesn't add up.. How can a ship with TMP Navagational Deflector devolve into a TOS style ship with the gold Navagational Deflector?

I mean please.. this is a total re-write or the 40 year trek history that we have all come to love.
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Offline Don Karnage

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #56 on: November 13, 2008, 04:53:49 am »
the saucer look like its from startrek the motion pictures.

the secondary hull look like a merge of the tmp enterprise plus a galaxy class.

maybe they are trying to make a pre startrek 1 after tos and screw up.

bad ship, paramount are trying to revive startrek after killing it with the last episode of enterprise.

Offline Don Karnage

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #57 on: November 13, 2008, 06:42:07 am »
here something funny i found

Offline atheorhaven

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #58 on: November 13, 2008, 11:59:54 am »
I'm just curious, does anyone know who did the model? It does look like another reboot of Gabe's, to me. What does anyone else think?



I think that you're linked to my "correction".  ;)

You're pointing to this one..


I don't know, I think that Gabe's looks better (personally).. this one looks more like what happens when you have some people in a room trying to design an update, and then pass it by for review past someone who never saw TOS, only TMP. 

("What's with that gold satellite dish on the front?  The front should be all blue-glowy!  Do it again!")

I have two major problems with this design.. the front deflector assembly and the blue lit strips on the nacelles.  If they'd cut that front solid section in half, and then bring everything abck, that'd help that out.. but those blue lit strips in a swoosh on the nacelle make no sense.  Are they supposed to serve a purpose, or are they just bling lighting?  "TOS Enterprise, lets pimp yer riiide!"  :p
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Offline Atolm-Rising

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Re: Trek 11 Enterprise
« Reply #59 on: November 13, 2008, 12:42:45 pm »
The main reason for the comments were simple:
The lack of respect towards the work involved in designing the ship.  Now I didn't say love anything...I said that things should be tollerated as for what they are.
And using a bridge pic, or a ship pic to discredit a whole film project is silly.  That has been the trend as of late.  Regardless if this is infact a reboot or not, it IS STAR TREK.  nothing you or I or anyone can say will change that.  Oh sure, as I have said many times before, people make trek to what THEY WANT IT TO BE, not what it is.  There is nothing wrong with that.  But I am ashamed at the venomous statements that have been made involving not just this film, but the franchise as a whole.  I really hated voyager, But it still is STAR TREK.  And I respect the time and effort that it took to do what they did.  I Strongly dislike the Sovie, but I'll never say it "sucks" and be serious about it.  That's what I am talking about.   
If you don't like the ship, fine, that's your perogative, but the lack off respect ("Bastard-prise" comes readily to mind).  I mean for Pete's sake, Trek fans fight over BS like it was a religion trying to discredit another one.
It's easy to say, "screw it, its going to suck", without even giving it a chance. 
There can be a lot of good from this endeavor, but we'll never know if we don't see it for ourselves.  That's what I am talking about.
Take the time, have the patience, don't take someone elses word (mine most of all...lol), wait and see for yourself.
BSG, Bond, I mean cripes, is it really that important, as to just hate something, be cause of how it looks?
BSG change stuff way more than the original, but it still is a great show.  To me it will not be the original, but that was never the point of it.  Capt_Pestalence_XC  posted a comparason shot of the TOS Galactica and the New one, and that only prooves to support how different, yet superficially similar they actually are.  The New Enterprise draws an even closer comparason to the TOS one than the two Gals of BSG, how funny is that.
With this new Trek movie, it is supposed to be a fresh new take on an old Ideal.  It is bound to piss all of us off to some degree or another, but you know what, I'll wait to be pissed off, when the flic comes out.
You will always have TOS, its not going anywhere...  But make room for the new TOS-Era Flic, that is based on technology, and style that is very much today, the 21st Century.

I personally love the ship design (mainly-as I joked with WZ about- because it doesn't look like it ripped-off any of my design details...  ::) ), There are some rough pointsa to the design, in my oppinion, due to my specific tastes in aestics, but other than that she's a connie... Just not your daddy's Connie.  The fusion of a retro-esque styling with how we would go about designing ta future ship, lends itself well as a sleek, very clean and smooth shape, with just enouth details in the areas, that would(and I agree with the designer's choices here) need them, with out over doing it.