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marstone

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« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2009, 04:46:55 am »
This is really no different than car bought prior 1990s as most just replace it after warranty was up.This is unless you modified the car then warranty was null anvoid.Today most people just lease their cars as what businesses are doing possibly with computers.

Guess I am not like most people.  Dang wish I had the money to replace a car just because the warranty was up.  Those are the cars I can afford to buy, the ones old anough to not have a warranty left on it.
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Khalee1

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« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2009, 05:33:47 am »
Well here is what I came up with dont know if it's a good one or not. But the price is about the same as my last computer too
And this is the site I went to not dell tho  http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/

CAS:NZXT Whisper (Black Color) Full Steel Silent Tower Case

CS_FAN:Maximum Enemax 120MM Case Cooling Fans for selected case (Maximum Silent Operation) [+29] (1,000 RPM Black Color with No LED Enlobal Magnetic Barometric Bearing 17 dBA)

POWERSUPPLY:In-Win Power Supplies [+49] (1,200 Watts Commander IRP-COM1200 SLI/CrossFireX Ready 80 Plus Modular Active PFC [+140])

CPU:Intel® CoreT i7-950 3.06 GHz 8M L3 Cache LGA1366 [+270]

OVERCLOCK:No Overclocking

FAN:Asetek Liquid CPU Cooling System (Extreme Cooling Performance + Extreme Silent at 20dBA)(Venom Boost Extreme OC Certified)

MOTHERBOARD:(3-Way SLI Support) EVGA X58 SLI Classfied Intel X58 Chipset SLI/CrossFireX DDR3 Mainboard w/GbLAN,USB2.0,IEEE1394a,&7.1Audio (Venom Boost Extreme OC Certified) [+205]

MEMORY:12GB (2GBx6) PC1333 DDR3 PC3 10666 Triple Channel Memory [+117] (Corsair or Major Brand)

FREEBIE_RM:None

VIDEO:PNY NVIDIA Quadro NVS420 512MB DDR3 16X PCIe Video Card

VC_GAMES:None

MULTIVIEW:Non-SLI/Non-CrossFireX Mode Supports Multiple Monitors

MONITOR:NONE

MONITOR2:NONE

HDD:Single Hard Drive (1TB (1TBx1) SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD)

HDD2:750GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM Hard Drive [+75]

USBHD:NONE

CD:Lite-On IHOS 104 4X Blu-Ray Player

CD2:(Special Price) LG 22X DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW Dual Layer Drive (BLACK COLOR)

SOUND:Creative Labs SB Audigy SE [+30]

SPEAKERS:None

NETWORK:Onboard Gigabit LAN Network

MODEM:US Robotics PCI 56K v.92 FAX Modem [+16]

KEYBOARD:Xtreme Gear (Black Color) Multimedia/Internet USB Keyboard

MOUSE:XtremeGear Optical USB 3 Buttons Gaming Mouse

TEMP:NONE

WNC:NONE

FLASHMEDIA:None

VIDEOCAMERA:NONE

PRINTER:None

PRINTER_CABLE:None

UPS:(Recommended) OPTI-UPS ES1000C 1000VA/700W Uninterrupt Power Supply [+149]

IEEE_CARD:NONE

USB:Built-in USB 2.0 Ports

FLOPPY:USB 1.44 MB EXTERNAL FLOPPY DRIVE [+59]

OS:Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional w/ Service Pack 3

FREEBIE_OS:None

TVRC:None

CARE:Professional Wiring for All WIRING Inside The System Chassis - Minimize Cable Exposure, Maximize Airflow in Your System [+19]

SERVICE:STANDARD WARRANTY: 3-YEAR LIMITED WARRANTY PLUS LIFE-TIME TECHNICAL SUPPORT

Panzergranate

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« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2009, 02:44:36 pm »
As an electronics engineer for many years than I care to remember, I can remember building Z80 based computers on Vero (strip) board, having to sort out the ROM code and watching it come to life.

I've both built up my own PC and used ready made ones. With ready made machines, like my motorcycles, it isn't long before I've taken out all the "manufactuer's compromise" compnents and tweaked it up a bit.

Even my old COMPAQ "Lugable" II runs a non-standard 80286 - 10 instead of the OEM 80296-6.

I prefer to tune up bought computers to a better spec than originally sold.

The Klingons have many ways to fry a cat. I prefer to use an L7 Fast Battlecruiser!!

Rod ONeal

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« Reply #23 on: August 22, 2009, 02:04:10 am »
My $.02 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ CAS:NZXT Whisper (Black Color) Full Steel Silent Tower Case Looks like an excellent case for the money. POWERSUPPLY:In-Win Power Supplies [+49] (1,200 Watts Commander IRP-COM1200 SLI/CrossFireX Ready 80 Plus Modular Active PFC [+140]) Probably overkill, but better too much than not enough. Looks like a good power supply. I like the modular design. CPU:Intel® CoreT i7-950 3.06 GHz 8M L3 Cache LGA1366 [+270] I'd go with the 920 and O/C it. Don't be afraid of overclocking. There's nothing to it. FAN:Asetek Liquid CPU Cooling System (Extreme Cooling Performance + Extreme Silent at 20dBA)(Venom Boost Extreme OC Certified) What are they charging you for this? I'm assuming it's just the LCLC system. Is there an upgrade option available? MOTHERBOARD:(3-Way SLI Support) EVGA X58 SLI Classfied Intel X58 Chipset SLI/CrossFireX DDR3 Mainboard w/GbLAN,USB2.0,IEEE1394a,&7.1Audio (Venom Boost Extreme OC Certified) [+205] Which board is this exactly? If it's this one ->EVGA 141-BL-E769-A1 <- it's W-A-Y overkill. This one-> EVGA 141-BL-E760-A1 is probably still overkill, but not as bad. Personally, I'd go with this one -> GA-EX58-UD5 <- by Gigabyte. Plenty of capabilities and a lot less expensive than either of them. Especially the 1st one. There are a lot of good boards out there though. I just happen to like Gigabyte. MEMORY:12GB (2GBx6) PC1333 DDR3 PC3 10666 Triple Channel Memory [+117] (Corsair or Major Brand) It's debatable whether or not you'll ever need 12gig of ram. Six is probably plenty. VIDEO:PNY NVIDIA Quadro NVS420 512MB DDR3 16X PCIe Video Card I wouldn't pay the premium for a Quadro or FireGL/Pro card. Sept 10th is the soft release date, which means it'll probably be a week or two after that before you can buy one, for DX11 cards. We're only talking a few more weeks. Don't buy a card until then. HDD:Single Hard Drive (1TB (1TBx1) SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD) If you have a choice get a WD Caviar Black. HDD2:750GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM Hard Drive [+75] Get a second HDD that matches the first one, ie the same model. It gives you more flexibility. CD:Lite-On IHOS 104 4X Blu-Ray Player There are compatibility issues with blue ray and 64 bit OS. Check that out first. You need 64bit OS to take advantage of all that RAM you are buying. CD2:(Special Price) LG 22X DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW Dual Layer Drive (BLACK COLOR) SOUND:Creative Labs SB Audigy SE [+30]Doubt you'll need that. On board sound is really good MODEM:US Robotics PCI 56K v.92 FAX Modem [+16] You still use dial up? UPS:(Recommended) OPTI-UPS ES1000C 1000VA/700W Uninterrupt Power Supply [+149] I can count the number of times I've needed a UPS on one hand with fingers left over and I used to live in East Tx. Odds are you won't need this, but it's your call. FLOPPY:USB 1.44 MB EXTERNAL FLOPPY DRIVE [+59] Definately don't need this. OS:Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional w/ Service Pack 3 64bit to use all that RAM. I'd consider Win 7 for DX11. If you have compatibility issues use some of the money saved above to have both OS and dual boot CARE:Professional Wiring for All WIRING Inside The System Chassis - Minimize Cable Exposure, Maximize Airflow in Your System [+19] SERVICE:STANDARD WARRANTY: 3-YEAR LIMITED WARRANTY PLUS LIFE-TIME TECHNICAL SUPPORT If Romulans aren't cowards, then why do they taste like chicken? Nemesis • Captain Kayn • Global Moderator • Commodore • Posts: 12490 Re: buying pre made computers or build it yourselve « Reply #24 on: August 22, 2009, 06:09:09 am » Quote POWERSUPPLY:In-Win Power Supplies [+49] (1,200 Watts Commander IRP-COM1200 SLI/CrossFireX Ready 80 Plus Modular Active PFC [+140]) Probably overkill, but better too much than not enough. Looks like a good power supply. I like the modular design. The power supply is NOT an area to stint on. Quote UPS:(Recommended) OPTI-UPS ES1000C 1000VA/700W Uninterrupt Power Supply [+149] I can count the number of times I've needed a UPS on one hand with fingers left over and I used to live in East Tx. Odds are you won't need this, but it's your call. A study was done years ago indicating that 85% of all computer "glitches" were bad power. I find that those with a UPS have fewer problems even if they THINK they have "good" power. Quote MEMORY:12GB (2GBx6) PC1333 DDR3 PC3 10666 Triple Channel Memory [+117] (Corsair or Major Brand) It's debatable whether or not you'll ever need 12gig of ram. Six is probably plenty. He is doing image editing which does tend to be RAM intensive. Quote OS:Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional w/ Service Pack 3 64bit to use all that RAM. I'd consider Win 7 for DX11. If you have compatibility issues use some of the money saved above to have both OS and dual boot He should be able to use it as the claimed limit for 32 bit Windows XP is 16gb. Do unto others as Frey has done unto you. Seti Team Free Software I believe truth and principle do matter. If you have to sacrifice them to get the results you want, then the results aren't worth it. FoaS_XC : "Take great pains to distinguish a criticism vs. an attack. A person reading a post should never be able to confuse the two." Pestalence_XC • "The Terminator" • Commander • Posts: 2636 • Gender: • "The Terminator" Pestalence_XC, Xenocorp Re: buying pre made computers or build it yourselve « Reply #25 on: August 22, 2009, 12:24:38 pm » He should be able to use it as the claimed limit for 32 bit Windows XP is 16gb. No, the limit for Windows XP 32 bit is 3GB natural or 4 GB using the /3GB switch in the system.ini file, and even then this dedicates 1 GB to the OS and leaves the other 3 GB to the programs. 64 bit XP has a 16GB limit IIRC. Vista and Windows 7 Ultimate editions 64 bit have no decernable limits ATM.. the standard rating for Windows Vista / Windows 7 Ultimate Edition 64 bit is 128+ GB. Now the limitation of Vista / Windows 7 is the fact that older modeling programs such as 3D Studio Max 4 /5 are incompatible because of the CDilla authentication tool built into the software and there is no work around for it as of yet. Simple solution is to Install Windows 7 Ultimate for newer modeling programs and then Dual Boot to XP (not VM or XP Desktop.. gimps all your hardware), Meaning a full install of XP on a second partition of your HDD to where you can select the OS on boot. XP will be gimped with anything more than 3GB requirements, but it is nice to have for older programs such as 3D Studio Max 5 and SFC OP (Dynaverse playability). I agree with the post above.. Quattro is a great card, however even though it is designed for use my animators and modelers, the GeForce series has way more options available plus the SLI factor is totally kick ass.. but I will price out for both the Quattro and the GeForce.. though IMHO the GeForce blows the Quattro out of the water currently on performance, especially on the Physics. also I agree with above posts.. wait on a new series of NVidia cards to debeut with Windows 7 for DirectX 11.. it will be the NVidia GTX 3XX series cards. as for CPU.. an i7 on the 920 chipsetr will work for you, however there are problems getting the i7 920 to overclock properly, especially when Intel put overclocking blocks on the i7 chipset series up until the 960 series (discontinues) so a 970/975 shipset series is what you actually want in order to overclock in the future to pull more life out of the CPU. for the most capability, the 980 series is the best, but it is a bit price prohibitive. Asus / Gigabyte are both good Mother Boards.. but performance wise, it is always best to go top end on your mother board.. never gimp on this as some people above have stated.. Consider, I get a top of the line board, it is already set up for Windows 7 / DirectX 11 and high performance out of box, plus I have many upgrade capabilities on the board.. or I can go with a mid grade board suggested above and in a year or 2 my system is gimped because of newer softeare requirements and the lack of ability to upgrade my system thus requiring a new mainboard yet again. Pay 2 times in 2 years for a 1 time price that will last you for the next 4 to 6 years.. tough call. as for system RAM.. many games coming out now require 4 GB ram to play and the Windows 7 / Vista with all eye candy on requires 1.5GB itself.. as such a system with 6GB should be enough, however Patriot Extreme makes DDR3 Lifetime Warranty that is 12 GB in 6 Dims and currently it is priced nicely..$259.99 for 12 GB. Now keep in mind that this is low latency gaming ram with an extremely high heat range plus it is rated to overclock for more speed and it has built in heat syncs. Works great on memory / Graphic intensive games such as AoC or Crysis. and there is very little degredation over time.. meaning your system can be gaming 24 / 7 for about 4 to 5 years before any noticable decline in performance.

I'll look up components from my supplier tonight and get a system similar to the one you have listed...

Give me the total price of what you are willing to spend on a system..
"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Nemesis

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« Reply #26 on: August 22, 2009, 01:12:52 pm »
No, the limit for Windows XP 32 bit is 3GB natural or 4 GB using the /3GB switch in the system.ini file, and even then this dedicates 1 GB to the OS and leaves the other 3 GB to the programs.

You're right of course.

I haven't actually hit the RAM limits on a PC since DOS days.  None of my current machines has more than 2gb, which is enough for my purposes.

Sorry Rod for my erroneous "correction" on that.
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Khalee1

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« Reply #27 on: August 22, 2009, 01:18:24 pm »
Sent you a pm Cptn_Pestalence_XC

FCM_SFHQ_XC

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« Reply #28 on: August 22, 2009, 06:15:48 pm »
Quote
EVGA X58 SLI Classfied Intel X58 Chipset SLI/CrossFireX DDR3 Mainboard w/GbLAN,USB2.0,IEEE1394a,&7.1Audio (Venom Boost Extreme OC Certified) [+205]
Stay AWAY from EVGA if you can at all possible levels.. their RMA is worse than dying a million times over

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Rod ONeal

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« Reply #29 on: August 23, 2009, 01:18:46 am »
A couple of caveats with Pestalence. Not too start a pissing contest or anything.

Top of the line motherboards are a waste unless you are going to do extreme over clocking. The ASUS Rampage II Extreme and Gigabyte GA-EX58-EXTREME, for example, are designed for things like LN2 and dry ice cooling which Khalee isn't going to use.

I know you're a big fan of Nvidea, but it isn't the only viable graphics processor company and you might very well be waiting until next year to get the 3XX cards. Nvidea, to my knowledge, doesn't even have a release date for those cards yet. The 5XXX from ATI will be out in Sept. and are worth looking at.

920's can be OC'd just fine. While the multiplier is locked you can still adjust the FSB. The additional cost for an i7 with an unlocked multiplier is a complete waste of money for a daily use PC. On Newegg, for example, the 920 is $280.00 the 975 is$1000.00. With good cooling you can get 920's to run at 3.8ghz 24/7, typically, at stock voltages.
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Pestalence_XC

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« Reply #30 on: August 23, 2009, 12:29:02 pm »
The factor you miss is that the mainboard is not FSB based on an i7 system, thus the multiplier is what you are actually overclocking.. as such when you adjust FSB on older systems, it is the multiplier and frequency that you are adjusting to gain speed.

I7's on the 920's you can adjust the frequency but the multiplier is locked, thus gimping OC builds..

On the i7 970 and above series, the multiplier is unlocked and the frequency is unlocked so you can actually OC to well over 5 Ghz. If using stock cooling (read fans / air cooling), then you can hit 4.6Ghz with a comfortable heat threshold limit given that the 975 CPU has a max heat limit of 130 W, where the 920 has a max heat limit of 90 W. I'm not even going into Standard CPU 920 vs Extreme 975 performance factors or processing capabilities, etc.. the 975 series blows the doors off anything on the market ATM next to the actual 980 series wich is OC capable of 1.3 times the 975 speed limits. for Cost Effectiveness, the 975 is the best buy on the market ATM.

Besides, I am thinking long term not short term.. the 920's are considered a mid grade shipset currently.. so that means next year they will be base model chipsets that you can buy at Wal-Mart / Best Buy..

With the OC capabilities of the i7 975 chipset.. the system will be viable for any software coming out for the next 5 to 8 years without upgrading, just use a simple OC to hit a comfortable stability for any new software.

I mean think about it seriously.. say a new game / program comes out requiring a 3.6 Ghz CPU.. well you will have to either upgrade or Overclock in order to use it.. on a system that is already OC'd to 3.8 GhZ, some instability may occur due to actually pushing the CPU to that speed 100% of the time playing the game..

Now with an i7 975 with the appropriate board, say 4 years from now, a program comes out that you really want for your computer and it requires a system with 4.2 / 4.4 GhZ requirements.. what are you going to do.. buy a new mainboard and a new CPU costing you about $800 on top of what you paid on your old board which was what$675.. so your overall cost for old board / cpu + new board / CPU = $1475 compared to spending$1250 now for a mainboard / CPU that can handle any program coming out with requirements up to 5.4 Ghz (i7 975 OC'd on water cool)... where the 920 would have already been obsolete 2 years prior.

I understand you are looking at Cost vs performance.. however so am I... You are looking at the here and now or the next year or so.. I am looking at 5 to 8 years down the line and removing the need to upgrade each year (Except maybe Video Cards).

Anyhow.. just letting you know where I am coming from.
"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Javora

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« Reply #31 on: August 23, 2009, 08:43:28 pm »

If using stock cooling (read fans / air cooling), then you can hit 4.6Ghz with a comfortable heat threshold limit given that the 975 CPU has a max heat limit of 130 W, where the 920 has a max heat limit of 90 W.

I understand you are looking at Cost vs performance.. however so am I... You are looking at the here and now or the next year or so.. I am looking at 5 to 8 years down the line and removing the need to upgrade each year (Except maybe Video Cards).

Anyhow.. just letting you know where I am coming from.

4.6Ghz on stock cooling??!?  That's insane.  What do you think is the life span on that processor is after being overclocked that much.  I can't think that type of overclocking can be all that healthy for it over the long run.  BTW I think your cost analysis for upgrade path was dead on, assuming that the processor doesn't get nuked.

Pestalence_XC

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« Reply #32 on: August 23, 2009, 09:37:52 pm »
so long as you don't exceel 70% of the maximum heat threshold, the CPU will run just fine OC'd at that speed.

so that means the CPU, as long as it doesn't go over 90w will be just fine at 4.6 GhZ.. with proper heat sync gel, Arctic Silver, applied properly on all heat syncs in the system (excluding the Heatsyncs on the RaM from Patriot, they already use Artic Silver), and have proper air flow afross the main board, meaning side cooling over the vid cards, Northbridge cooler fan, Ram Cooler fan, upgraded Cooling fan for the CPU, PSU with its own independant 140 MM cooling fan like Ultra PSUs, 140 MM intake cooling fan (filtered to prevent dust contamination that traps heat / silicon shorting) 2 exhaust fans of at least 120 MM and proper exhaust fron the Vid cards, and having throttled cooling fans in each location so that the cooling can scale with the heat generation.. the system should never go beyond 55w on the main board, and the CPU should never go above 65w. now pushing the CPU to its limits, I agree, at 5.4 GhZ with water cooling, the life of the CPU will be about 5 years tops since the average heat generation on the CPU die will be about 90% of threshold.

Now heat generation will also be determined by CPU load as well.. currently there is no software on the market that requires a CPU running faster than 3.0 GhZ on a dual core.. since the i7 975 is an extreme quad core, the heat threshold will be lower than the heat threshold of a Core 2 Duo dual core (the cores process at a faster rate = less processing time = less load = lower heat generation, spread across 4 CPU instead of 2 = a much lowe load = much lower heat generation).

Also a determining factor is the break in and how it is done.. if running CPU stock, you have a break in period of about a week.. if you decide to OC later on, you need to repeat the break in process for optimal performance at the new speed..

Now a lot of this is case dependant for having the proper cooling... If you go with a compact tower case, then heat build up is a problem.. if you go with a case that has proper ventalation and has proper intake / exhaust fans, then cooling becomes a moot point since the air flow itself will disapate the majority of the heat, and you only have to worry about the physical heat of each component, instead of components and ambient internal case temperature (cascading heat generation).

the COre 2 Duo's on the E8750 series could easily overclock to 4.2 Ghz with stock cooling, however this took the CPU above the 70% air cooling threshold, and as such, the CPU only had a 3 year life, which is why most OC experts recommend a 3.8 GhZ limit on the Core 2 Duo series CPUs for aircooling, with water cooling, the limit was 4.6 GhZ, however the Core 2 Duo's have a heat limitation of 90w unless you were using the Extreme 9XXX series Intel Core 2 Quads which had the 130 W limit, however because of Core 2 limitations, OCing the Extremes wasn't gaining much more speed than the Core 2 Duo CPUs could gain.

On the i7, for the money, the 975 is probably the best CPU for OCing on the market currently, even the 980 and 985 i7 CPUs can't OC faster than the 975, add to that the cost of the 980s is way too prohibitive.

Anyhow.. just check out some OCing sites that have OC'd the 975 i7 Extremes and their comparrison to the other i7 series chipsets..

That is the best I can tell ya..

Anyhow, the main factor is how much are you willing to dedicate to your system .. do you only have enough to build a per year system (replacing components each year) or do you have enough to build a system that needs no part replacements for the next 5+ years (excluding Video Cards).

It is all about your budget.. You buy what you can afford, but make an informed decision.. look at all the variables involved.. OS, Software progression, DirectX 9 for XP vs DirectX 11 for Windows 7, More powerful Vid Cards for years of gaming vs a mid grade vid card that may only last the next year of game development.. etc..

I'm just saying weigh all the factors involved and make decisions based on how long  you want your system to work with software development vs cost of build vs cost of upgrading to keep up with software..

Now in my business I always go from Top of the line best possible stuff and then downgrade the system to meet my customer's budget, which is how all PC manufacturers should operate.. not like Dell starting with a dirt machine and attempting to build it up using substandard materials.

The only other company that orperates building gaming machines like I do is Alienware.. they make different class machines based on different budgets, and I start with top of the line and work down.. so Alienware has a better "Selection" than I have, but their markup is almost 150%. Mu "Selections are based on component downgrades of non essential components and then start down grading components like RAM and Vid Cards and CPU.. so in essance I can build any system that Alienware offers, but I build in reverse order based on budget, where you have to build up a system within your budget with most other companies.

Anyhow.. am still looking up components for Khalee's system.. some parts I normally use are out of stock ATM, so looking at other vendors / pricing.
"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Rod ONeal

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« Reply #33 on: August 23, 2009, 10:42:16 pm »
Sorry mate, looking around I can't find the figures you are quoting. Tom's Hardware and Anand Tech, 4.14 to 4.17 for D0 975's on air, and that's not stock, but after market coolers. 920's 3.8 seems pretty typical. I've read articles comparing the 920 to either the 965 or 975, can't remember which one, but at the same clock speed there was no performance difference. \$730.00 for 350mhz is not worth it to me.
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Pestalence_XC

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« Reply #34 on: August 24, 2009, 01:37:10 am »
welp.. Just to show you

And This is Air Cool ATM.. though this type of OC really needs water cool.. now a stable running system is 4.6 Ghz under air cool..

so I guess Tom's Hardware know jack sh*t about overclocking a system. look at my CPU-Z below.. 5455.4 Mhz.. and this is the limit I can reach without having a a Cryo system on board.

Under 5 benchmark programs, the CPU scores between 4.98 Ghz to 5.45 Ghz with the current configuration with an ambient temp maxing at 87 C, still below the 90C degradation threshold under air cooling, however the Motherboard is not rated for this temp range, the motheer board is only rated 90 C max, as such, water cooling is needed to bring temps down to around 68 to 70C.

Please, I hate having to tweak my systems like this to prove a point.. I usually run this one at 4.6 Ghz. It is just a shame that this isn't my system personally but one that I'm selling.. wish I could afford to have these components for my main box

CPU-Z posted below ... this is an i7 975 XE
« Last Edit: August 24, 2009, 02:44:40 am by Cptn_Pestalence_XC »
"You still don't get it, do you?......That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!"

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Javora

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« Reply #35 on: August 24, 2009, 08:21:47 am »
Excellent couple of posts Pestalence, they were good reads.

Rod ONeal

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« Reply #36 on: August 24, 2009, 05:56:10 pm »
welp.. Just to show you

And This is Air Cool ATM.. though this type of OC really needs water cool.. now a stable running system is 4.6 Ghz under air cool..

so I guess Tom's Hardware know jack sh*t about overclocking a system. look at my CPU-Z below.. 5455.4 Mhz.. and this is the limit I can reach without having a a Cryo system on board.

Under 5 benchmark programs, the CPU scores between 4.98 Ghz to 5.45 Ghz with the current configuration with an ambient temp maxing at 87 C, still below the 90C degradation threshold under air cooling, however the Motherboard is not rated for this temp range, the motheer board is only rated 90 C max, as such, water cooling is needed to bring temps down to around 68 to 70C.

Please, I hate having to tweak my systems like this to prove a point.. I usually run this one at 4.6 Ghz. It is just a shame that this isn't my system personally but one that I'm selling.. wish I could afford to have these components for my main box

CPU-Z posted below ... this is an i7 975 XE

Rather than pick out one site and proclaim that, "so I guess Tom's Hardware know jack sh*t about overclocking a system", I think it is more likely that what THW, and every other professional site I've checked, calls stable and what you call stable are two different things.

Here's another consideration when looking at what's a stable OC. A quote from "another" site. They had OC'd a 975 to, what they thought was, a stable 4.2Ghz. Upon further examination they found this out.

http://techgage.com/article/intel_core_i7-975_extreme_edition/1

<snip>
After some investigation, it turns out that the CPU was indeed throttling due to temperatures, and in Cinebench, the CPU would drop down to around 4.0GHz, whereas with a more robust benchmark like LinX, it'd drop to 3.7GHz. Even at 3.7GHz however, it was completely stable with LINPACK testing for hours, and that in itself is impressive.
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toasty0

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« Reply #37 on: August 24, 2009, 09:54:58 pm »
Ok, that's it....each of you...jumper clips at 30 paces.
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Rod ONeal

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« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2009, 11:08:53 pm »
Ok, that's it....each of you...jumper clips at 30 paces.

Back off buddy or I'll say something derogatory about Microsoft.
If Romulans aren't cowards, then why do they taste like chicken?