I can completely uninstall the Catalyst drivers and install the lastest ones without having to reinstall Windows each time. Still runs perfect.
If there is anything to slam about ATI drivers, is that getting them completely uninstalled can be the problem. In order to do it right, you need use your search feature and kill off the rest of the clutter left behind. RegCleaner comes in real handy to clean up your registery.
But after that, installing the new drivers goes without a hitch.
People tend to want to treat their computers like a toaster. No added maintenence deemed neccessary. You keep your OS going for a year or two, trust me, your system is far from perfect. The only computers I see that can keep going for years without a fresh install of the OS tend to be buissness computers that aren't going through a bunch of different driver updates, OS updates, and having such items like video cards and sound cards being replaced every year. The reason they can last is because they rarely ever have any changes to them. Now personal computers, that's a whole different story. They can go through constant changes to numerous to list here. But let's just say the Windows isn't exactly at it's best when it comes to keeping the clutter from interfering with it. It's that clutter from left over driver uninstalls, various register clutter from long gone apps, and basic junk that has been installed on the system. You would be surprised how much faster and stable your computer is after a fresh install of Windows.
Back to my video card:
I have ran the 9700pro on two completely different systems, and both times it runs just about perfect.
I never stated any of their cards never have any problems, but then again I have had game troubles with Nvidia cards and their drivers so anyone announcing that Nvidia has no problems just hasn't met the game/chipset/processors combos these quirks come up on.
I have built a new system recently and have the benifit of reformating my hard drives several times in the past month. Not because of anything doing with my video card, just checking out each component and testing them out. Once I get everything in order, I will throw on Windows and keep it running for months. But in that time I have yet had any problems getting the 9700pro stable. If there was a component that was giving me trouble it was my ASUS motherboard, but nothing a bios upgarde couldn't fix.
I can reformat my hard drive, install the OS, get the neccessary updates, and get most of my important apps installed, and even tweak my system a bit in three hours time. Three hours really isn't a long time to start from a fresh install of WIndows to fully fuctional system in my book. Heck, I've seen people spend more time detailing their cars on a Saturday afternoon.
As for games, I have thrown a few on over the past month to give my system a run through. The current games and apps I have tried hasn't given my any gamestopping problems with my 9700Pro, but then again I don't mind having to tweak a game to get it to run correctly on my systems, or search for patches and utilities to get around certain problems. I know in time that most problems will be fixed by a patch from eiither the game company, or the video card company. Of course most people don't have the patience I do when it comes to computers. They want it now, perfect, and will run flawlessly on a infinate number of systems. Even in the end, regardless of what you use, nothing put out is 100% perfect. I know ATI has had problems, and still has some problems with their past video cards. I understand that for a time that ATI had problems with thier drivers, that in some cases have never been resolved. Well, ATI knows that, understands that, and is actively trying to correct those past problems. It's damned if you do, and damned if you don't with people. That's the main reason that the 9700Pro is my first ATI video card. They always had impressive video cards, but their driver support was sorely lacking. I do my homework when it comes to buying anything. That's the great thing about the internet, the world's biggest database of knowledge. If I listen to nothing but the fanboys or the naysayers, would I truely be doing myself a service when buying a video card? Probably not.
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I don't treat a computer as a houshold appliance. Maybe it's because I got into computing when the Apple ][e and the Commandore 64, IBM PC were kings. Computers and OS's weren't built to be "dumb downed" for the masses. It took a person to actually learn something to new in order to run them. Not just hit the power switch and be greeted with a happy GUI. It really wasn't that long ago that mouses were not standard equipment on a computer, nor did you just double click on an icon.
Since that time I have built countless number of computers, had to set up and run numerous pieces of hardware, and have to deal with several different OS's. There was no Windows, or USB, or plug and pray around when I first started. The internet was a pipe dream. Microsoft was more noted for it's Flight Simulator, than being the juggernaut OS leader they are today. And believe or not, most of us didn't have a hard drive. We ran everything out of the RAM. Hard drives back then were insanely expensive.
It's because of that past that I still look at computers as an ongoing project. Something that needs to be tended to, not simply stuck on a desk and forgotten about. To me they were never designed to be placed into the hands of people who didn't have the willpower to actually learn about what they were using. Instead, thanks to Microsoft and Apple, now people expect them to be like that foremetioned toaster.
I keep hearing people say they don't have the time to do a reformat of their hard drives. Oh but they have enough time to screw around on game message boards, and also play those games. But nooo, can't do a reinstall of WIndows. Sorry if I don't buy into that. People are lazy, they don't want to do it, but sorry, sometimes it's neccessary.
It's really not that hard. All that stuff you can collect on your hardrive can be transfered off that drive onto a partion, or second hard drive, or in my case, both.
Personally I'm pretty anal when it comes to backing up my stuff. If I have something on the C: drive that I really want to keep, it isn't too hard to transfer another copyt to another partion and my second hard drive. I even go extra mile and burn some stuff onto CD's. I'm just in the habit of never leaving anything important on the C: drive by itself. I make copies. Regardless of how much stuff you accumalate, there is always a way to make a copy of it. The best way is just to purchase another hard drive.
I keep folders for every little thing I download. The reason I can get my system up to speed from scratch pretty fast is that I have darn near everything I need stored on my second hard drive. Once an OS is installed, it nothing more than point and click. I even have my serial numbers stored in text document, so I can simply cut and past them into the fields. Every driver I download is filtered off into it's own folder. That folder has three copies to it. One on my parition, one on my second hard drive, and one on my CD.
It's almost scary how fast I can get my systems up and running, and do most of it using one hand on the mouse.
Game folders and patches can be saved. If I have any saved games on my system that I want to keep, I simply save the folder they are stored in. Most games have patches that you can also store. I try never to rely on the internet as my sole means of getting my patches installed. If I can download a full version of the patch, driver, or app, then that's what I do. Saves bunches of time from not having to dowload it. Especially if your still on dial-up.
If you never make any atempt to back up your stuff on your C: drive, your just asking for a heartbreaking experince if you hard drive crashes, or your get a paticulary nasty virus, or because of an install of something, it crashes your Windows partion. Then what are you going to do? Guess you'll have to reinstall Windows at some point. And then of course you'll have to spend an insane amount of time getting it back to the way you want it.
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So ya, I'm a bit touchy about this. I can understand people if they have had problems with ATI products in the past, and are hesitant to ever purchase their products again. I would be too probably, but I wouldn't count them out forever. The people my posts were aimed at are the ones I never stop seeing.
You know the ones, the people who have never owned any the metioned products, the ones that love to spread the hersay about products when they clearly never did their homework to find out the factual information. The ones the go strictly on word of mouth, from other people who are as naive about the products as they are.
And then there are the people who never rise above doing nothing else but turn on the computer, and click the icon. I have had people proudly boast they know nothing about their computers and are intent on keeping it that way. "I pay people to install new hard drives or CDRW's" or " I will never reinstall Windows, when I can get someone else to do it". I lump these nitwits into the same catagory of people who believe a college education is all the learning they need in life. Believe me, I have had people say these things to me. A good chunk of people these days wants other people to do their thinking for them. That's pretty sad if you ask me.
So yeah, I get cranky when ignorance is passed around like it's the word of a god.
If you have an actual complaint about something based on good information, or hands on experience, I have no problem with that.
But when people start trying to influence other people by nothing more than word-of-mouth, that annoys me. I'm sorry, but your friend of a friend of a friend story, shouldn't be used to convince somebody that some product is crap. Try finding out yourself. It really isn't that hard to do.
You know something, I have never had to call customer service on anything computer related since hooking up to the internet. If I have a question about something, a little digging is usually all I need to find out what I need. I'm not saying there will never be a time I would need to call, but that says something about how great the internet really is. It's just too bad that there are still some people to lazy to go find the info themselves. It's one thing to be clearly befuddled about something, but how many problems can be resolved with nothing more than typing the info your looking for into a search engine and clicking the search button? Think about how much less bad information would be passed along if everyone just look ed up some information about whatever subject they aren't clear on? Like these ATI vs. Nvidia threads.
Nowdays, I do my homework on just about every product I buy. I don't check just one source, I check a multitude of different reviews, analyst breakdowns, reader submitted reviews. In short everything I can get my little mouse pointer on. I don't trust one source of information, I gather many sources and come up with my own conclusions. Then I will buy the products, give'em a test drive. If they are not up to par with me, then I return it for something different. But the last thing I do is try to spread false rumours. I try and give various companies a chance to prove themselves. There was a time no one would touch AMD chips. To slow, to hot, to buggy. But look how far they have come. If people still relied on the bogus info that is pass around these days, no one would buy the Athlons. There are still people who believe that info, like it's in some holy scripture.
It's the same thing with video cards. Is ATI ever going to have a chance to shed their past problems? or are they forever going to be haunted by their past problems? Take my advice, the LAST thing you want is for ATI to bite the dust. You think video cards are expensive now, just think of world now without them. Your going to have to take out a second mortgage on your house to pay for the current Nvidia offering, and do you think they would have the motivation to keep improving their line of cards?
That's what happen to Intel, until AMD gave them a good slap in the face. It's taken Intel almost three years to soundly take back the performance crown from AMD, and in that time we have seen some great prices on processors, and in turn on motherboards and memory. Not to metion some innovative and remarkable products introduced by both Intel and AMD. All that wouldn't have happen if AMD didn't break out of their shell, run up the battle flag, and take Intel to the limit. We would most likely still be running processors under 500mhz, we would have no speedy FSB, or nice fat caches running at full clock speed. Or various specialized instruction set, and of course no Hyper-Threading on the P4 3.06.
Why bother if you don't have any comptition?
And that's why I write these long-winded posts. If your smart, you'll want ATI to succeed in a big way. Same goes for just about any product out there.
But bad info passed along doesn't help that cause.
Hey if your fine running what you have, than that's what is important. I have my Geforce3 in my second system. Good card, though had to suffer through some bad Detenator drivers. If Geforce is your thing than by all means keep with them.
But try not dragging ATI through the mud if you don't really know anything about them. And I have seen plenty of those on these boards and others that tell me that there are still plenty of people who haven't got their facts straight on these issuses. All i'm doing is trying to enlighten the crowd so to speak...
P.S. GEE-ZUS! this a long post. Damit, you people got me writing a novel...grrrrrr
Topic: In responce to comments made about ATI Technologies and their products (Read 18581 times)