Topic: Star Trek Axanar  (Read 29566 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Captain Adam

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 754
  • Gender: Male
Star Trek Axanar
« on: June 11, 2014, 08:02:45 pm »
.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2016, 02:51:26 pm by Captain Adam »
Odo :    
"Being accused of a crime is not a disgrace, Chief. Some of the great figures of history have shared the honour with you."
to O'Brien
DS9 : Tribunal

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2014, 09:22:49 pm »
Aw, but the Enterprise looks nothing like the JJprize!
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2014, 09:54:39 pm »
I'd watch that, but they'll never get the money to keep it up. I like how the Klingon actors are now playing humans relfecting on the Klingons.

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2014, 09:56:46 pm »
But it's still pretty good.

You've read my past posts, so you have to know that was sarcasm.  I guess I'll just have to give a serious critique of the ship:

It has TOS saucer, and I much prefer that over TMP saucer.  I prefer TMP details, but TMP saucer got flattened, so it looses a bit of weirdness.  I like spaceships to be a little weird.  I prefer TMP torpedo section, but this version of the Big-E has one.  This is a major improvement over TOS, because it makes sense to store all the fuel for the torpedoes on the secondary hull.  I also like the warp nacelles.  They're smaller than TMP nacelles, but that's ok.  The glow on the fronts on the nacelles are a little too bright.  I'm sure they can clean that up before release.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2014, 10:06:39 pm »
I don't know what time period they are going for, but I like how it looks that it is in the ten years between the end of TOS and TMP.

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2014, 12:44:35 am »
I kno.

It's amazing how all these little guys keep going. The trailer is good though. The voices of the actors are strong and intense. Smart move. And did you notice the Cylon. Lol

I could have sworn the guy giving the impassioned speech was Vin Diesel.  He'd make a better Klingon than the people playing Klingons.  I missed the Cylon.  I'll have to look it over again.

I don't know what time period they are going for, but I like how it looks that it is in the ten years between the end of TOS and TMP.

This is the what I really hate about the ST canon.  The difference between TOS Enterprise and TMP Enterprise stems from 3 axis:  15 years experience in space model workshops, budgets for same, and Big Screen detail requirements.  The Enterprise refit was just a convention to explain the inadequacy of the original Enterprise model for a Cinematic feature.  What that convention can never do is make an early 1960's television spaceship model work in a HDTV world.  That model needs to be abandoned for higher production standards.  TMP model is really good.  That isn't to say it couldn't be better, but if I had to stick with any model made for any ST, that would be it.

In 2nd Place comes TMP Klingon Battlecruiser.  The studio model had too many ridiculous gimblies, and they blued it all to Hades in post production, but it was cool-looking anyway.

I'm tired of ST productions wearing the ST canon like a strait-jacket.  This is the one thing that JJ Abrams got right.  ST can go in so many directions.  Personally, I'd like to see someone take up the concept of that a starship contains an enormous power source.  Nuclear weapons and nuclear power were very much on the minds of 1960's sci-fi writers.  With Star Wars in the 1970's, spaceships and space weapons were not so high energy as highly magical, and I think that universe effected the creators of ST.

There is a good example of this between "The Enterprise Incident" and STIII "The Search for Spock."  In TOS, Kirk bluffs that he's going to self destruct the Enterprise.  He does this by sending a general warning of an enormous blast radius.  As the Romulans decode the message, they give the Big-E space to slip away and try out the cloaking device.  In STIII, Kirk does self destruct the Enterprise, but it just blows a few big holes in itself and falls out of orbit.  Considering that they were able to siphon one ounce of anti-matter from the engines in TOS episode "Obsession," any physicist could tell you that a starship would have a truly scary explosive potential.

As a matter of fact, TOS did better with high energy explosions than any later production of ST.  They used strobe lights to represent the flash of truly powerful detonations.  It may have been cheaper than showing a nice orange fireball, but considering spaceships run on anti-matter and not gasoline, I should think the resulting explosion would tend toward the blue end of the spectrum, if not down into the gamma rays.

Even Warner Brothers classic cartoons of the 1950's had a better handle on high energy.  The "Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator" looked like a firecracker but was supposed to deliver a (very literally) "Earth shattering kaboom."
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Lieutenant_Q

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1669
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2014, 01:07:02 am »
I would be really worried if someone thought that the best way to destroy a Starship was to INTENTIONALLY set off it's warp core.  See the destruction of the ENT-D in Generations.  The Self-Destruct sequence is something that would need to be used in different situations, obviously destroying the Starship is the last option, but if it comes down to it, you never know if you need to minimize, or maximize the "collateral damage".  Also, check the fact that Kirk would have known that after sacrificing the Enterprise, he still needs a way off of the Planet that he was about to strand himself on (the condition of the planet wasn't yet known to him) the Bird of Prey was his only way home, Destruct Sequence 1 was probably the smallest explosion, while Destruct Sequence 2 or 3 would be something that would take out the Enterprise, and half the Star System in the process.

It looks to me that they are going for the time between ENT and TOS, about 20 years prior to TOS, Garth of Izar and Robert April are supposed to be in this project.  I hope they finish it, because it looks good so far.
"Your mighty GDI forces have been emasculated, and you yourself are a killer of children.  Now of course it's not true.  But the world only believes what the media tells them to believe.  And I tell the media what to believe, its really quite simple." - Kane (Joe Kucan) Command & Conquer Tiberium Dawn (1995)

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2014, 02:05:16 am »
I would be really worried if someone thought that the best way to destroy a Starship was to INTENTIONALLY set off it's warp core.  See the destruction of the ENT-D in Generations.  The Self-Destruct sequence is something that would need to be used in different situations, obviously destroying the Starship is the last option, but if it comes down to it, you never know if you need to minimize, or maximize the "collateral damage".  Also, check the fact that Kirk would have known that after sacrificing the Enterprise, he still needs a way off of the Planet that he was about to strand himself on (the condition of the planet wasn't yet known to him) the Bird of Prey was his only way home, Destruct Sequence 1 was probably the smallest explosion, while Destruct Sequence 2 or 3 would be something that would take out the Enterprise, and half the Star System in the process.

It looks to me that they are going for the time between ENT and TOS, about 20 years prior to TOS, Garth of Izar and Robert April are supposed to be in this project.  I hope they finish it, because it looks good so far.


I did think they might have methods of reducing collateral damage in the event of self-destruction, but I think it is more a matter of the creators' imagination.  On top of that, how can you render anti-matter inert?  Back in the 1950's, our government was planning to fight and win a nuclear war with the Soviet Union.  MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) had not yet become policy.  During the Cuban Missile Crisis, the United States military determined that the US would prevail in an all out nuclear exchange should it come to that.  Within the next 2 years, Matt Jefferies designed the USS Enterprise model, with the main engines separated from the hull as if they contained "dangerous energies."  TOS was produced right after nuclear tensions between the super-powers was at their height.

By the time the ST movies were made, nuclear weapons were something people could put to the background of their minds.  Ray-guns were clean, magically-powered weapons.  As a matter of fact, they got too clean and magical, so in Aliens, they reverted back to old fashioned gun-powder.

To get one in the mindset for high energy, I'd like to direct you to some films released by the US Department of Energy.  I would remind you that these weapons are BS compared to the weapon at the disposal of a starship commander.

Nuclear Weapons Tests: Operation Upshot-Knothole - 1953 Documentary - WDTVLIVE42


Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2014, 02:13:59 am »
I need to add another one to show how crazy nuclear tests become, right at the inception of ST.

hydrogen bomb and nuclear tests in space


I will withhold my comments on this, for now.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2014, 05:35:15 am »
"Red Matter," Puh!  I was excited to go an see the first JJ Trek, and was happy to see new actors, but that turned me off right there.  ST is supposed to be hard SF pushed to the fantastic, with some fantasy aliens thrown in to make it interesting.

Here's something for you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO1nvmDjofo
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2014, 05:44:48 am »
BTW I came across this bit of shiny when I first saw the promo you posted about.  I commented on this version of the Big E.  I like it almost as much as TMP Enterprise.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Imrcpt_a888
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2014, 09:24:58 am »
There is a good example of this between "The Enterprise Incident" and STIII "The Search for Spock."  In TOS, Kirk bluffs that he's going to self destruct the Enterprise.  He does this by sending a general warning of an enormous blast radius.  As the Romulans decode the message, they give the Big-E space to slip away and try out the cloaking device.  In STIII, Kirk does self destruct the Enterprise, but it just blows a few big holes in itself and falls out of orbit.  Considering that they were able to siphon one ounce of anti-matter from the engines in TOS episode "Obsession," any physicist could tell you that a starship would have a truly scary explosive potential.


I believe that you are confusing two episodes for one. In "The Enterprise Incident", Kirk never pulled the explosion bluff. He stole the cloaking device and they installed it while Spock stalled for time, eventually running away and cloaking to evade the Romulans. You are thinking of "The Deadly Years", where after being cured from his old age Kirk bluffs the Romulans by announcing that there is no hope for escape and that he will detonate the "corbomite device recently installed". He then uses the ground they give up to make their escape. There is no evidence that such a device, or a material such as corbomite, even exists. The original ruse was to an alien who had no way of knowing what it was or if it was real. The Romulans giving ground at least points to the fact that the substance does actually exist and has significant destructive power.

Offline Lieutenant_Q

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1669
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2014, 11:02:57 am »
If you read the website at http://StartrekAxanar.com it tells you exactly what the back story is.  It IS set in the Prime timeline.  It's about the 4 years war that ended roughly 20 years prior to TOS.

During the War the JJ ships were pretty much all wiped out by the Klingons, newer ship designs, more akin to the original Enterprise (not the JJ Enterprise) were more combat oriented and able to go toe-to-toe with the Klingons.


As for explosions, yes an ounce of anti-matter could take out a City Block, it's clear that Starships have several hundred tonnes of it in storage.  However, whats not clear is if there is any diminishing returns on that much antimatter.  There's not that much matter to react with, once the ship itself is out of the way.  Also remember that even though its called anti-matter, its really not anti-matter.  It's anti-something, and it will only react with whatever that something is.  If they were smart about it, (and capable of doing it) they would make the anti-matter be the opposite of whatever the smallest amount of matter on board the ship is, to reduce the chance of an accident destroying the whole ship.  While we have been able to create Anti-Hydrogen, that to me is asking for trouble.  Any storage containers have to have no Hydrogen at all in them, that's a very difficult construction practice (for the moment), not saying it's not possible, but just extremely difficult.  To me it seems likely that one of the higher noble gasses is the most likely candidate to be used as fuel for a M/AM reactor, heavier, but easier to filter out.
"Your mighty GDI forces have been emasculated, and you yourself are a killer of children.  Now of course it's not true.  But the world only believes what the media tells them to believe.  And I tell the media what to believe, its really quite simple." - Kane (Joe Kucan) Command & Conquer Tiberium Dawn (1995)

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2014, 01:50:46 pm »
There is a good example of this between "The Enterprise Incident" and STIII "The Search for Spock."  In TOS, Kirk bluffs that he's going to self destruct the Enterprise.  He does this by sending a general warning of an enormous blast radius.  As the Romulans decode the message, they give the Big-E space to slip away and try out the cloaking device.  In STIII, Kirk does self destruct the Enterprise, but it just blows a few big holes in itself and falls out of orbit.  Considering that they were able to siphon one ounce of anti-matter from the engines in TOS episode "Obsession," any physicist could tell you that a starship would have a truly scary explosive potential.


I believe that you are confusing two episodes for one. In "The Enterprise Incident", Kirk never pulled the explosion bluff. He stole the cloaking device and they installed it while Spock stalled for time, eventually running away and cloaking to evade the Romulans. You are thinking of "The Deadly Years", where after being cured from his old age Kirk bluffs the Romulans by announcing that there is no hope for escape and that he will detonate the "corbomite device recently installed". He then uses the ground they give up to make their escape. There is no evidence that such a device, or a material such as corbomite, even exists. The original ruse was to an alien who had no way of knowing what it was or if it was real. The Romulans giving ground at least points to the fact that the substance does actually exist and has significant destructive power.

ST first aired the year I was born.  In my earliest memories, it was rerun at 11:00 on Sunday mornings.  It must have occupied that time slot over ten years.  The problem was that I'm a late sleeper.  I know ST more from the ends of episodes.  It occupies a place in my psyche where it is conflated with memories of dreams.  For this reason, I you will probably need to correct me again.

Now that TOS is on Netflix, I've been watching each episode, beginning to end.  I limit myself to one every other day.  Unfortunately, I skipped "The Deadly Years," because I thought that aging and reversing the aging was ridiculous, and did not want to subject myself to it.  I guess I have to, now.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline FPF-DieHard

  • DDO Junkie
  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 9461
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2014, 01:55:00 pm »
Who'd thunk that Star-castling was the root of all evil . . .


Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #15 on: June 12, 2014, 03:01:59 pm »
If you read the website at http://StartrekAxanar.com it tells you exactly what the back story is.  It IS set in the Prime timeline.  It's about the 4 years war that ended roughly 20 years prior to TOS.

During the War the JJ ships were pretty much all wiped out by the Klingons, newer ship designs, more akin to the original Enterprise (not the JJ Enterprise) were more combat oriented and able to go toe-to-toe with the Klingons.


As for explosions, yes an ounce of anti-matter could take out a City Block, it's clear that Starships have several hundred tonnes of it in storage.  However, whats not clear is if there is any diminishing returns on that much antimatter.  There's not that much matter to react with, once the ship itself is out of the way.  Also remember that even though its called anti-matter, its really not anti-matter.  It's anti-something, and it will only react with whatever that something is.  If they were smart about it, (and capable of doing it) they would make the anti-matter be the opposite of whatever the smallest amount of matter on board the ship is, to reduce the chance of an accident destroying the whole ship.  While we have been able to create Anti-Hydrogen, that to me is asking for trouble.  Any storage containers have to have no Hydrogen at all in them, that's a very difficult construction practice (for the moment), not saying it's not possible, but just extremely difficult.  To me it seems likely that one of the higher noble gasses is the most likely candidate to be used as fuel for a M/AM reactor, heavier, but easier to filter out.


Please don't say the JJ-ships ever existed.  While they're plain ugly, I really can't take their impossible inter-dimensional dream-like configuration.  I mean, the Enterprise is not Dr. Who's tardis.

Based on one Wikipedia entry, my rough calculation puts one ounce of anti-matter into the range of 600Kt yield, so one gram would be worth about 700Kg of TNT.  OK, I see, I may have written "ounce," but you read "gram."  So, one O-Z of anti-matter is only worth about a dozen Tzara Bombas.  I would have thought it enough crack a planet in two.  It's good to have someone inspire you to look things up and do the calculations, every now and then.

This gets me to revisit ideas inspired by "Balance of Terror."  Spock said the Romulan ship was powered by "simple impulse."  Since interplanetary travel on the ST time scale is impossible without "warp speed," what the writers may have meant was that it had a had a fusion power plant instead of a matter/anti-matter reactor.  Should a Romulan torpedo be composed of hundreds of Kilos of fusion fuel, and a photon torpedo composed of only tens of grams of anti-matter, the Romulan weapon could very well be much more powerful than the federation weapon.  I like sci-fi when it obeys the laws of physics in unexpected ways.

As far as storing anti-matter goes, they've only recently been able to store Anti-Hydrogen, and then, up to 16 minutes.  To think of fusing anti-hydrogen into heavier elements would require a feedback powered containment system that boggles the imagination.  Then, we are talking about a civilization with warp drive, so this wouldn't be far out at all.  No wonder why gold is "worthless."  It could very well be industrial waste, and associated with dangerous radiation.  The US actually contemplated casing nuclear weapons in gold to produce more fall-out.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2014, 03:03:50 pm »
Awesome. I love the videos. Was that a Gorn design? Or some weird Romulan. Threw me off.

I don't know what it is either, but it is now my 3rd favorite Star Trek model.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Sirgod

  • Whooot Master Cattle Baron
  • Global Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 27831
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #17 on: July 04, 2014, 06:06:57 pm »
WOW! I just got around to watching this trailer, and man, that looks awesome!

The reflections of both sides, The CandyMan vs. the Klingons, This would make for a great show.

Stephen
"You cannot exaggerate about the Marines. They are convinced to the point of arrogance, that they are the most ferocious fighters on earth - and the amusing thing about it is that they are."- Father Kevin Keaney, Chaplain, Korean War

Offline Bernard Guignard

  • Cad Schematics are our Speciality
  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 887
  • Gender: Male
  • Trek Canon!!! I NO believe in TreK Canon!!!.
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2014, 09:14:17 am »
Saw the trailer and I'm looking forward to seeing the first episode  ;D

Offline Age

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2689
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2014, 06:26:01 pm »
These look more like JJ ships and hasn't Star Trek been $crewed around to much.I much prefer this over that.it may have better talent but lacks originality.




Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2014, 12:25:08 am »
I'm looking forward to Axanar as well.  It'll be interesting to see how they flesh out that storyline.

Lots of Starship Pron here:
https://www.facebook.com/StarTrekAxanar/photos_stream

The image showing the class silhouette comparisons is pretty cool!


Offline Lieutenant_Q

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1669
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2014, 08:09:28 pm »
So.. they are debuting the film Prelude to Axanar at the North Houston Convention Aug 8-10...

Tickets are $25 for a day, $50 for the whole thing.  Most of the cast and crew will be there for it as well.

Just my luck... I've got my wedding reception in MI that weekend.
"Your mighty GDI forces have been emasculated, and you yourself are a killer of children.  Now of course it's not true.  But the world only believes what the media tells them to believe.  And I tell the media what to believe, its really quite simple." - Kane (Joe Kucan) Command & Conquer Tiberium Dawn (1995)

Offline Javora

  • America for Americans first.
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2986
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #22 on: July 30, 2014, 07:07:26 am »
To bad they didn't schedule the show in January when I was down in San Antonio.  That would have been fun to watch.

Just curious Lt. Q where are you headed to in Michigan?  Don't need exact details, figure if I know the general area I can give you a heads up at the bad areas.

Offline Lieutenant_Q

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1669
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #23 on: July 30, 2014, 11:03:25 am »
I'm going home, my entire family lives in the West Michigan Area.  With the exception of myself, my sister, and couple of cousins, everyone stayed home.  I went to Houston, my sister is following her husband in the USAF, and a couple of cousins went to work in Washington.  My Wife and I got married a couple of months ago, and her family is here in Houston.
"Your mighty GDI forces have been emasculated, and you yourself are a killer of children.  Now of course it's not true.  But the world only believes what the media tells them to believe.  And I tell the media what to believe, its really quite simple." - Kane (Joe Kucan) Command & Conquer Tiberium Dawn (1995)

Offline Lieutenant_Q

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1669
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #24 on: July 30, 2014, 12:45:42 pm »
Here's the complete story of everything else that's going on at that convention and some more details regarding it:

http://www.yourhoustonnews.com/atascocita/news/the-houston-con-to-feature-power-rangers-star-trek-walking/article_ab6ff292-a810-5e21-bc2e-fd6e6a5d7124.html?mode=story
"Your mighty GDI forces have been emasculated, and you yourself are a killer of children.  Now of course it's not true.  But the world only believes what the media tells them to believe.  And I tell the media what to believe, its really quite simple." - Kane (Joe Kucan) Command & Conquer Tiberium Dawn (1995)

Offline Age

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2689
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2014, 07:14:56 pm »
They will keep talking about like Renegades but won't do any filming untill they have enough to finance it.

Offline Lieutenant_Q

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1669
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2014, 07:27:35 pm »
According to the article, they have completed it, and will debut it there.
"Your mighty GDI forces have been emasculated, and you yourself are a killer of children.  Now of course it's not true.  But the world only believes what the media tells them to believe.  And I tell the media what to believe, its really quite simple." - Kane (Joe Kucan) Command & Conquer Tiberium Dawn (1995)

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #27 on: August 01, 2014, 07:00:38 am »
It looks pretty good so far, but I don't buy Hatch as a Klingon.
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline Vipre

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 3105
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #28 on: August 01, 2014, 03:18:18 pm »
Prelude is finished. Thx to D_M for the heads up.

Second video on the page. Run time 0:21:10 1080p available, only official viewing location.

"PRELUDE TO AXANAR"
Lapsed Pastafarian  
"Parmesan be upon Him"

"Dear God,
   If aliens are real please let them know that I'm formally requesting asylum from the freakshow that is humanity."

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2014, 10:57:59 am »
Well that second video was terrific!!!!!!!!!!! :woot:
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2014, 12:21:43 pm »
They are meshing JJ trekverse tech with prime universe. Amazingly this doesn't bother me much. This is the kind of kicka$$ story that should be done. I don't see that I can donate this month, but hopefully I can make a pledge next month. I want to see this happen. 8)
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline Age

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2689
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #31 on: August 03, 2014, 03:55:33 pm »
The storyline looks good but it is the tech that doesn't do it form me untlll later on.It is like Adam said.It does look better than JJs.

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2014, 05:42:14 am »
Here's the complete story of everything else that's going on at that convention and some more details regarding it:

Your link nearly overwelmed by pop-up blocker!
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #33 on: August 31, 2014, 02:24:12 pm »
Just gotta say...

I really like the lines of the D-6 in Prelude to Axanar.    The other ships too, although the one fed design (USS Geronimo) with the second (forward) set of impulse engines in front of the dual secondary hull struts seems like a bad idea to me... there's inice angled shot showing off the full view of this second set of engines at 10:43 in the video.

That being said, the USS Geronimo looks like quite the nice ship otherwise!   I would just have moved that second set of impulse engines outboard a bit, so that the impulse isn't thrusting against the two necks.

I also very much like the lines of Sonja's ship, the Ajax.  Several shots, including the feint at 12:31, show off this design rather well.

Very much liking the choice of actors as well!

Overall, a nice starting point for this!  Very much looking forward to the full release.

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #34 on: August 31, 2014, 02:48:45 pm »
The Geronimo design is weird in many respects unless it is a carrier. You're right though, the pylons should be moved down to attach at the saucer bottom for the rear set of engines and it doesn't need two deflector dishes in any case.

Offline FRA.E.Kehakoul_XC

  • Administrator
  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1100
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #35 on: May 12, 2015, 04:09:28 pm »
Gentlemen,could it be that it is Released?

Check this link: http://amovieweb.com/roy/full.php?movie=3302086

Kehak
FRA.E.Kehakoul_XC

Director - Diplomatic Division

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #36 on: May 12, 2015, 05:08:40 pm »
Gentlemen,could it be that it is Released?

Check this link: http://amovieweb.com/roy/full.php?movie=3302086

Kehak


Well, since they are still building sets, and just launched the kickstarter for the full length feature,  I'd say no...
http://www.startrekaxanar.com/captains-log/

Where that link to amovieweb.com requires a login, I'd be highly suspicious of any requested credit card data should anyone want to sign in for that service.  However, if anyone does get past the login, feel free to report your findings.

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #37 on: May 12, 2015, 05:50:59 pm »
It was fully funded through kickstarter back at the end of august.

Studio flooring went in in march so I guess it will be quite awhile still.
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #38 on: May 12, 2015, 06:10:37 pm »
Even still it is a shot in the dark. If Paramount passes on giving them a deal I'm not sure if they can legally release it.

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #39 on: May 12, 2015, 11:40:58 pm »
It was fully funded through kickstarter back at the end of august.

Studio flooring went in in march so I guess it will be quite awhile still.


Actually, Prelude To Axanar was fully  funded in August (they raised $80,000)... not the full length film.

Here is the donor page for the full length feature:
http://www.startrekaxanar.com/donate/

Even still it is a shot in the dark. If Paramount passes on giving them a deal I'm not sure if they can legally release it.


That's why the are only calling it Axanar now (no Star Trek prefix, although the Website still has the prefix).  They are in that weird zone where all of the fan-produced spinoffs are, and apparently are toe-ing the line appropriately.  That could always change though.  They can't charge for the release itself, but baubles (Axanar shirts, mugs, etc) are another story, as long as it doesn't say Star Trek on them...  Prelude to Axanar was released under these conditions, and cost $80,000 in donations to make.  They can't sell the Movie/Prequel in any shape or form, but it's available for download (for free) in a few places.

Said baubles are tied to the donation levels, similar to what happens on PBS with donations.  AFAIK they aren't selling them directly.

And trust me, with the star power and buzz that Axanar has been working with, I'm SURE Paramount is well aware of their existence.  Doesn't mean that Paramount won't change their tune at some point, but I'd be interested if they got 'written permission assuming not-for profit/free'' as insurance.

Star Trek New Voyages, Phase II, etc. are in stickier territory, as they are using the main roles (Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Scotty, etc.).  Nonetheless, they've been releasing episodes for years now.  I'm guessing that Paramount feels that this keeps the 'fan base' together for the next time Paramount does an official release, but of course that can change.  Other fan film franchises have suffered at the whim of various studios.  As an example, at one point, there was a cool new fan made live action Robotech movie with a couple of segments released, but the second Harmony Gold found out about it, cease and desist...

ST:OGAM (Star Trek: Of Gods And Men) was another released 'film' which had Nichelle Nichols and Walter Koenig in it.  Check it out if you can find it, if you haven't seen it yet!  I'm guessing that Renegades (the planned spinoff from STOGAM) fell by the wayside, though.

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #40 on: May 13, 2015, 07:11:27 am »
8,548 backers pledged $638,471 to help bring this project to life.

That's from their site. I donated a few days after they reached their target in late august, after I got back from my vacation trip.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/194429923/star-trek-axanar

Try this page. Yours doesn't work.
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #41 on: May 13, 2015, 02:34:23 pm »
8,548 backers pledged $638,471 to help bring this project to life.

That's from their site. I donated a few days after they reached their target in late august, after I got back from my vacation trip.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/194429923/star-trek-axanar

Try this page. Yours doesn't work.


Yes it does.  Just clicked the link to double check.
http://www.startrekaxanar.com/donate/
Screenshot of above page attached.
Although the page you mentioned does exist as well (it's linked via another submenu), they are still accepting donations via PayPal, BitCoin, and Axanar Interactive.

So if the link isn't working for you, your computer must be broken.  Or the internet from your location...
 :D

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #42 on: May 13, 2015, 04:45:32 pm »
I wouldn't count "Star Trek: Renegades" down and out yet - their website has a recent trailer posted http://startrekrenegades.com/home/. Their situation is sorta flipped of "Axanar" - they completed their fundraising and principal photography and are now in post. Supposedly they were going to screen it for CBS to see where it goes from here.

With a handy grain of salt or two, it might go nowhere, but given CBS/Paramount's apparent relaxed approach to these productions, I would at least expect to see Renegades show up a la Phase II, OGAM, Farragut, etc. Personally I likke Axanar better, but I feel both shows demonstrate that there's more to mine in the Prime era than just "reboot"ing accomplishes.

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #43 on: May 14, 2015, 01:56:13 am »
I wouldn't count "Star Trek: Renegades" down and out yet - their website has a recent trailer posted http://startrekrenegades.com/home/. Their situation is sorta flipped of "Axanar" - they completed their fundraising and principal photography and are now in post. Supposedly they were going to screen it for CBS to see where it goes from here.

With a handy grain of salt or two, it might go nowhere, but given CBS/Paramount's apparent relaxed approach to these productions, I would at least expect to see Renegades show up a la Phase II, OGAM, Farragut, etc. Personally I likke Axanar better, but I feel both shows demonstrate that there's more to mine in the Prime era than just "reboot"ing accomplishes.


Well, while I'm not optimistic r.e. CBS picking up the pilot (IMHO they'd have better luck with NCIS - Starfleet), it's good to see they are about done with Renegades at least.  Hopefully we get some sort of release this year out of them.  I suspect that Axanar will be a 2016 thing...

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #44 on: May 17, 2015, 09:17:13 pm »
And trust me, with the star power and buzz that Axanar has been working with, I'm SURE Paramount is well aware of their existence.  Doesn't mean that Paramount won't change their tune at some point, but I'd be interested if they got 'written permission assuming not-for profit/free'' as insurance.


Paramount would have to be blind not to since they showed the prelude at Comic-Con. I'm hoping that they can turn it into a series. They'd only need five seasons (a half season of prelude and epilogue and four seasons of the war) to do it and these days that's not very long to ask for. Anything longer than that would just be bonus.

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #45 on: May 22, 2015, 12:07:48 pm »
This comment made me sad...

Quote
Last weekend during a Q&A session at Fan Expo Regina, Jonathan Frakes, who played Commander William T. Riker in Star Trek: The Next Generation, was asked about the possibility of a new Star Trek television series. Frakes responded by saying that he had pitched a concept to CBS, which owns the rights to the franchise and unfortunately, and they don’t seem to have any interest in a new Trek series.

Frakes continued by saying that CBS feels it diluted the Star Trek brand throughout the 1990s and early 2000s combined with the poor box office performance of 2002’s Star Trek: Nemesis.

With the success of Star Trek (2009) and Star Trek Into Darkness, he said CBS wants to keep the property as focused and concentrated as possible.

Sounds about right, although I do think that the right vehicle could do well on TV.  Enough time has passed that a lot fans are looking for something new, and won't take a good Trek series for granted.  Still bummed that they didn't give Enterprise at least one more season - it was just getting interesting, but at that point people were pretty trekked out.

The Stargate franchise did the same thing - i.e kept making spinoffs/episoded longer than they probably should have.  Universe had some potential, but the concept had pretty much played out at that point.  The rights holders are going back to movie land for now, with a fresh take, as they feel that's the best way to get bang for their buck with that franchise going forward.


Also, supposedly Renegades (what they currently have done)  will be shown at FedCon in Germany this Weekend, with several of the cast members in attendance at FedCon.  It'll be interesting to see if they can get enough groundswell to get CBS to agree to at least let a Renegades television series out into the wild (on SyFy or something).  My guess is that CBS will not greenlight it, but we can always hope.

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #46 on: May 23, 2015, 01:20:23 pm »
OK Adam, watch the prelude again and find your happy place!  :P ;)

That is dour news as to CBS's commitment factor, but Frakes went to them with an idea and an open hand based on his relationship to the franchise. These guys can show up with a finished, polished product along with a itemized budget showing how low cost it can be if they want to keep a leash on it. The only thing really standing in the way is creative vision on where they want this to go. If CBS is filled with youngish people that are the type that believe that absolutely nothing good could have possibly been created before they were born, this project has no chance for long legs and we will have to hope that they can release it for free.

I agree that they kind of burned out the series with too much at once, but folks were complaining about the quality of the storytelling in the movies and shows long before Enterprise put the nail in it. That they can't see that it is a problem with what they are doing with the universe and not fatigue of the universe itself that causes veteran fan disenchantment is baffling since there is plenty of desire for Trek still, hence all the fan flicks. Any long running series will have clunker episodes, but when entire series like DS9 and Voyager can't even get rerun airtime while TNG is played over and over to death shows something about the fan base. People seem to hate the idea of those shows enough that they can't even garner rerun ad revenue, yet they complain about no new trek on TV. Studio execs look at performance like that when gauging the viability of future projects.

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #47 on: May 23, 2015, 04:58:40 pm »
eh, I'm not so sure of your take on this Corbomite. Nothing personal, it just seems a little backwards. CBS isn't run by teenagers, it's just that teenagers are a huge market now. DS9 & Voyager are not really in reruns so there's no ratings numbers to go by (except for their original runs mostly). While Trekkies sure have different opinions, most of the fans I know (as the coordinator for a ST meetup group of 200) don't hate the idea of some Trek, they just prefer another. And Frakes' opinion is based on meeting with the powers-that-be and what their current plans for ST are - to focus on "one" Trek and the movies. It won't matter if Axanar has 13 eps in the can on a shoestring budget; while that might impress some bean-counters, they just won't change their "focus" on movies, at least until they start bombing.

All this is conjecture of course - I only work in local television - but CBS has lots of executives shoring up their present plan. The sad irony is that the "goal" that most incarnations of ST aimed for was "to appeal to outside the fan-base," and when they finally achieved that in JJ-Trek, they turned their back on that fan-base. I'm still grateful that CBS lets these fan films exist and circulate, and who knows, maybe they'll see the light someday. I appreciate that Simon Pegg might have the best of intentions but I have no real hope the "ST Beyond" will be any better than ST-09. (It's got to be better than "Into Drekness," right? Right? )

I was disappointed a couple of years ago when having a conversation with Frakes - he liked JJ Trek 09. It mad me sad.

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #48 on: May 23, 2015, 07:59:08 pm »
It's sad that the CBS executives have any respect for JJ Trek.  Those films were hoaxes.  JJ Abrams sold us a ST "reboot" and we got some kind of sick self parody.  It does not produce a fan base.  It will not produce a revenue stream.  Producing more along these lines will produce diminishing returns, and the executives know it.  They simply think the old farts, like us, are played out.  This means that there will be no new ST, until a highly motivated trekkie with a really good idea shows the right executive a really good time.  After this next idiotic ST movie, there will be no new ST.  There will be no new television production.

The main reason is that the revenue stream will be uncertain.  Television is in crisis, because it is an outdated technology.  It's important, because the corporations that run this country have been depending on it to distract and misinform the American public since the middle of the 20th Century.  Unfortunately quality programing winds up on the internet and is distributed for very little cost or even free.  The audience for this show is even less likely to watch it on commercial television than any other audience.  Science Fiction is expensive to shoot, so distributing premium product without anybody actually paying for it doesn't make sense.

The only way that a studio is sure to make money on this is to tie it into computer games.  Television executives do not know how to do this.  Disney works along these lines, but I don't know if their model would work in this case.  By now, the formula for successful computer games should be well established, but you never can underestimate the idiocy of the people who have real power in this country.

For all the CBS executives, here is how you make money from Star Trek:

Step 1.)  Get a handful of geeks to put together a new, consistent ST universe.  That is, they pick and choose not simply what they think is cool, but what they think fits comfortably together, and pare the story world down to its core elements.  The political back story and technology has to be laid out so that everybody creating content will know what is consistent.  At this point, the pay off is still far away.

Step 2.)  Research successful computer games, and game companies.  Research old ST games.  Prepare to form separate partnerships with several companies making very different games.  Do not put all your eggs in one basket.  Allow the game makers to make suggestions for the story world.  Keep quality at the top of priorities.  On line games should be affordable, and the gamers should understand that the production of the new series is dependent on the success of the games.  That way, people may buy more than the they really use.

Step 3.)  Find good writers, and make them study Stargate SG-1.  The technobabble in this series always made perfect sense, despite involving up to date theories on quantum physics and cosmology.  ST, even at its best only sounded like BS.  Only now, can you be ready for production.

Step 4.)  Only build sets if the price of CG remains high.  GM and Toyota are not going to foot the bill when your audience isn't watching the commercials, so you just won't have the budget of TNG, DS9, Voyager, or Enterprise.  Promote the games as a the revenue stream for the series.

Unless my pronouncement of the death of commercial television is premature, this is the only way I can see a new ST series paying for itself.  It is radically different from anything done with television before, and depends on the success of a number of elements CBS has no control over.  In short, a producing new ST series is just too complicated.  It takes too much imagination, too great an understanding of the audience, and too great an understanding of an unrelated industry.  Studio executives just want to do the same thing they've done for the last 60 or 70 years, even though that business model is dying.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #49 on: May 24, 2015, 09:48:57 am »
Teenagers have been a huge target market since the 1950s and their ever shifting preferences have vexed advertising and entertainment execs since the beginning (except for maybe Don Kirshner).

I didn't mean that CBS is run by teenagers. I meant that many times when these guys look back for ideas to mine for their reboots, remakes, revisions, they only seem to look as far as that it was popular and (ultimately) profitable, but don't seem to want to put in the effort to find out why. The thing about ST is that it appeals to all ages. It appeals to a certain type of person and that person is likely to be like that for most, if not all, of their lives. This is something demographics doesn't seem to take into account. They seem to think we all still go by the '50s notion of rebellious, over-sexed teens listening to noisy rock 'n roll to responsible adults listening to Frank Sinatra to old farts listening to Lawrence Welk. This doesn't work for SciFi fans. Once a SciFi fan, always a SciFi fan, yet they continue to ignore this fact and act like our money is no good, even though we are the most vociferous and well earning group in entertainment fandom and pretty much always have been.

ST has never really performed that well at the box office (until recently). The only reason it was promoted and propped up for the big screen is the success of Star Wars. Its home is the small screen where it has time to explore its universe and itself. It is not for everyone and their attempts to make it so are ridiculous. Why is it that only the publishing and sports industries seem to understand the value of a lifelong fan? Other industries claim to, but with their constant tinkering and reworking and then their ire at poor fan reaction to that tinkering and reworking, it seems like they are out of touch and that loses customers. Look at what's happening to Game of Thrones. As soon as they started deviating greatly from the source material (even though it would have been pretty much impossible to follow the book storyline as it is written), all the cries of anguish began, and the books aren't even done yet so people don't even know what is going to happen with these events. Now, these changes were necessary due to time and the medium they are translating into, but the fans don't care. They still cry out in anguish.

So, when David Gerrold, the person known for writing the best known episode of the original idea you are trying to rework, reboot, revision, tells you that "This is  Star Trek!", and puts his hat in the ring to consult for the project, you, as an entertainment exec, might want to take notice and ask yourself "why?" instead of assuming that there is an app for that and everything will be fine as long as profits are up for that quarter. Axanar is approaching one million views, and that's for a tiny project that really hasn't been promoted outside of the ST/SciFi community. Not taking notice of that is foolish IMO. There is room for both TV and films stories here and the good thing about Axanar is it draws on all the history that they have presented while not stepping on too many toes to do it. It doesn't conflict with any current timeline or project at all and since the reboot is technically a whole new timeline I don't understand their resistance to a well budgeted TV series that lets them expand and keep their base audience. Hell, they could even claim it was part of the new timeline and get away with it. I've shown Axanar to people who don't even like ST and they were just blown away and said they'd watch it just because of Tony Todd's speech.

That's the end of my rant today. I don't know what will happen tomorrow.  :soap:
« Last Edit: May 24, 2015, 09:59:25 am by Corbomite »

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #50 on: May 24, 2015, 02:04:05 pm »
Whose Lawrence Welk?

 :angel: DOB 1985  :laugh:

Someone who was old when I was born nearly twenty years before you. It helps to prove my point though. I once said to a friend of mine that we were going to be the craziest old people when our time came because we weren't going to be sitting around listening to Lawrence Welk like our parents and grandparents. When they had that one off Led Zeppelin reunion concert awhile back and the tickets sold out in like twenty seconds for a band that hadn't been seen since 1979 I felt vindicated.  8)

Yet the entertainment industry still labors under the assumption that you are just about useless after your 40th birthday.

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #51 on: May 24, 2015, 04:37:26 pm »
Whose Lawrence Welk?

 :angel: DOB 1985  :laugh:


There are still Lawrence Welk reruns in my area.  Just sayin!

He was slightly before my time too, but conservative values folks love their Lawrence Welk - he represents that bygone era that they look back on with rose colored glasses...

BTW, Renegades (the full pilot - with some incomplete placeholders for some CGI shots) aired as scheduled yesterday at FedCon.  Supposedly donors will be getting their copies sent out in the next few weeks, according to some post I read on the TrekBBS.
http://www.scififantasynetwork.com/star-trek-renegades-pre-premiere-at-fedcon-24/

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #52 on: May 24, 2015, 05:56:40 pm »
Not gonna lie. Not really feeling the Renegades. Esp the Fed/Rebel ships design

I'm more of an Axanar fan myself, but they have some familiar faces in Renegades, and I'd love to see how the concept/pilot plays out.  Even if they go with a Netflix style release, there will be some happy fans if they can find a way forward.

While I totally get that you have a board room of CBS execs pontificating on what they think today's youth want, in my conversations with some of the younger sci fi fans these days, a LOT of them are watching the older stuff, a lot more than people give them credit for.  Plus, you'd think that with The Big Bang Theory being CBS's #1 comedy (I still love the Tiny Spock episode, that was damn funny!) they'd get that there is a fan base for this sort of stuff, even on network TV.  But yeah, Hollywood hasn't been good at connecting the dots, or executes them poorly when they sorta kinda get a clue...

We all should remember that Hollywood is run by corporations, not artists.  And corporate types look at everything from the lens of risk vs. return/maximizing profits.

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #53 on: May 24, 2015, 06:54:46 pm »
We all should remember that Hollywood is run by corporations, not artists.  And corporate types look at everything from the lens of risk vs. return/maximizing profits.

Which is why I hope that this project impresses them enough to start something. These guys making Axanar seem to acutely understand this.

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #54 on: May 24, 2015, 08:47:23 pm »
I'm pretty sure that "fan-made" is the future of ST.  I don't see a revenue stream for television.  The last two movies seemed to be more like nails in a coffin than anything new.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Sirgod

  • Whooot Master Cattle Baron
  • Global Moderator
  • Vice Admiral
  • *
  • Posts: 27831
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #55 on: May 26, 2015, 11:00:29 am »
I'm looking forward to both to be honest. I loved the work the Renegade team done on " Of God's and Men" If I recall the name right.

Axanar is just pure military fun for me.
"You cannot exaggerate about the Marines. They are convinced to the point of arrogance, that they are the most ferocious fighters on earth - and the amusing thing about it is that they are."- Father Kevin Keaney, Chaplain, Korean War

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #56 on: May 26, 2015, 12:30:02 pm »
I'm looking forward to both to be honest. I loved the work the Renegade team done on " Of God's and Men" If I recall the name right.

Axanar is just pure military fun for me.

I like that they aren't mutually exclusive.  Axanar doesn't appear to mess with the TOS timeline, so it should drop in nicely.  Renegades is post-Voyager, so it won't be messing with the 'previously established timeline' either.  So we can have both co-existing peacefully with each other.  Unlike the JJ Trek, which ignores everything and starts it's own lame timeline.

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #57 on: May 26, 2015, 01:00:32 pm »
They both have their positive qualities, but I'd still rather see Axanar simply because we have never seen that era at all. I've had enough of the TNG+ era for awhile.

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #58 on: May 26, 2015, 03:54:28 pm »
I hate going off thread, but, seriously, the entertainment industry is a mostly a means for advertising, and there's plenty aimed at the above 40 crowd, it's not all about the teenagers. If not dying, television (as we know it) is morphing rapidly into something else, to be determined, but I don't see tying it to a computer game will be a survival tactic for anyone.

The real elephant in the room is that we, as Star Trek fans, are a miniscule audience, and science fiction fans are only slightly larger. "We" did not make Star Wars a hit, or Avengers, or Alien et. al., the general public did. To the suits, Science Fiction is a type or genre, like rom-coms, horror,  action, superheroes and so forth, to make product in. Amen to that Hollywood (entertainment in general) is run by corporations comment, although I'd rather curse the fact, it's not going to change anytime soon.

I loves me the Axanar, and would love to see Renegades just because it's a "realer" Trek, but... They won't become "real." I want them to, you want them to, but it ain't gonna happen. Maybe if enough of "us" cheer it on, make them a success, then maybe, maybe, when ST12 or 13 or 14 tanks, then they'll say, "let's bring it back to TV/streaming/whatevs for the 'old fans.'"

PS, add another fan-film to the list - just heard about this today
http://www.startrekcaptainpike.com/

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #59 on: May 27, 2015, 09:21:07 am »
Mars Direct has been pushing a do-able cost effective Mars mission since 1992. It has no more stable funding now than it did then. NASA was pretty hot for it at first, but as soon as certain programs realized it was going to be done without them and that it might affect their funding, the resistance started. The Moon base program has been defunded as well. Besides, what makes you think it would be any different than the Apollo program? "Hey, we made it to the Moon! Well, that was fun, now let's completely forget about it and stay in low orbit for decades."

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #60 on: May 28, 2015, 11:13:02 am »
nothin' wrong with being one of those there optimists, it's just so damn hard sometimes ;)

Just a reminder, TOS was a ratings failure during the Gemini/Apollo heydeys and barely got a third season because of fans like us (althought the supposed cancellation of season 3 that spawned the leter-writing campaign was mostly rumor).

Once a niche audience, always a niche audience.

Offline Javora

  • America for Americans first.
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2986
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #61 on: May 28, 2015, 09:39:58 pm »
Not gonna lie. Not really feeling the Renegades. Esp the Fed/Rebel ships design

Actually I like the Renegades for a different reason.  Renegades looked like it was more about action instead of just talking about things that happen.  It's one of the few complaints I have about the other Trek as well including Axanar.  To keep production costs down they have to do that before but now there is no excuse.  This line of thinking they have is what is holding back good Sci Fi, well that and a good story week after week but I that is another topic for another time.

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #62 on: May 29, 2015, 10:05:17 am »
Not gonna lie. Not really feeling the Renegades. Esp the Fed/Rebel ships design

Actually I like the Renegades for a different reason.  Renegades looked like it was more about action instead of just talking about things that happen.  It's one of the few complaints I have about the other Trek as well including Axanar.  To keep production costs down they have to do that before but now there is no excuse.  This line of thinking they have is what is holding back good Sci Fi, well that and a good story week after week but I that is another topic for another time.

Maybe us old folks don't need ADHD paced action to hold us.  I liked the style and thought that went into Prelude to Axanar. I showed it to a few other friends at work who are into sci-fi and they all thought it was good. Everyone 45 or older in my circle though.
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #63 on: May 29, 2015, 01:00:43 pm »
Axanar is entirely about a huge battle that determined the outcome of a galactic war and changed the course of the history of the Federation. How much more action do you need?

Offline Javora

  • America for Americans first.
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2986
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #64 on: May 29, 2015, 09:43:39 pm »

Maybe us old folks don't need ADHD paced action to hold us.

I think there is some truth to that.  After raising five kids and listening to their friends, ADHD of some form seems to be the norm.  I blame it on cell phones.  That reasoning shows up in the money generated by the recent action movies at the box office.  I knew I was going to take some junk from posting earlier but my kids liked the JJ Trek a lot better than the older stuff.

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #65 on: May 30, 2015, 02:04:06 pm »
my 18 year old is as typical as they come when it comes to cels/FB etc, and she laughed her way thru "Into Drekness"

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #66 on: May 30, 2015, 05:45:34 pm »
my 18 year old is as typical as they come when it comes to cels/FB etc, and she laughed her way thru "Into Drekness"

Here I am, and I still can't convince my older brother that JJ Trek is anything less than a methodical deconstruction of ST.  It's a freaking joke, but it merely offends the average fan of the franchise.  Your daughter falls in a tiny minority of people that get it, without being offended.  The rest, just don't have a clue.
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #67 on: June 02, 2015, 06:23:31 pm »
I just had a thought and converted this to play on my big screen TV. Damn it looks even better bigger!

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #68 on: June 03, 2015, 01:27:51 pm »
I have my old computer hooked up to a 39" screen so I have played SFC pretty large.


I just thought of something. I wonder how Axanar is going to show the interiors of the ships. It will be interesting to see if they go all retro like they did with the uniforms or a little sleeker with less interior space. Those old Enterprise corridors were huge and the little oval view screens in the first pilot looked retro even in the '60s.

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #69 on: June 03, 2015, 06:56:19 pm »
I have my old computer hooked up to a 39" screen so I have played SFC pretty large.


I just thought of something. I wonder how Axanar is going to show the interiors of the ships. It will be interesting to see if they go all retro like they did with the uniforms or a little sleeker with less interior space. Those old Enterprise corridors were huge and the little oval view screens in the first pilot looked retro even in the '60s.


You REALLY should be following the daily blog...
http://www.startrekaxanar.com/2015/06/

The jelly bean buttons are out, touchscreens are in.  As for the 'periscope' viewer, no word on that yet...

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #70 on: June 03, 2015, 07:29:23 pm »
I have my old computer hooked up to a 39" screen so I have played SFC pretty large.


I just thought of something. I wonder how Axanar is going to show the interiors of the ships. It will be interesting to see if they go all retro like they did with the uniforms or a little sleeker with less interior space. Those old Enterprise corridors were huge and the little oval view screens in the first pilot looked retro even in the '60s.


You REALLY should be following the daily blog...
http://www.startrekaxanar.com/2015/06/



The jelly bean buttons are out, touchscreens are in.  As for the 'periscope' viewer, no word on that yet...





It was just a passing thought. I don't really  want to know yet. I like to wait and be surprised, like I was surprised that they managed to make those old style uniforms actually lay correctly.

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #71 on: June 15, 2015, 08:53:55 am »
File this under "another 'fan' project that may/may not go anywhere" - Michael Dorn's pet project Captain Worf is still floating around out there

http://www.blastr.com/2015-6-1/michael-dorn-updates-us-his-proposed-capt-worf-series-and-reveals-intriguing-plot-details

I suspect that, as usual, most ST fans would be more interested in this than the next film in the JJ series

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #72 on: June 15, 2015, 09:21:12 am »
I wouldn't. Captain Sisko was right, Worf would never be offered his own command after what he did.

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #73 on: June 15, 2015, 06:23:12 pm »
sure, I get the reference ;) but Worf did no worse than any other Trek captain. I mean, Sisko assassinated a foreign dignitary. ("In The Pale Moonlight")


Oh, okay, so did Worf ("Reunion"), but, that was, like, a Klingon thing. Prime Directive and all that.  :D

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #74 on: July 13, 2015, 08:05:14 pm »
This is just a beautiful shot:

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #75 on: July 13, 2015, 10:46:26 pm »
"I hate to see you leave, but I love to watch you go"

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #76 on: July 21, 2015, 03:35:11 pm »
For anyone that might care, the indiegogo fundraising campaign is here:

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/star-trek-axanar#/story

Stretch goals are targetted up to $1,320,000, so far they've raised over $270,000 of that goal as of this post.  This does not include previous efforts (cost to produce Prelude to Axanar, costs associated with  getting studio up and running).

Offline EschelonOfJudgemnt

  • Lt. Junior Grade
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #77 on: July 27, 2015, 06:29:11 pm »
Interesting Axanar blog news.

Today, they featured FASA'a Star Trek Starship Tactical Combat Simulator via a guest blog:

http://www.startrekaxanar.com/axanar-gaming-star-trek-starship-tactical-combat-simulator/

Anyways, at the bottomf of the blog posting, it says this....

Quote
We’ll have some more stuff on the FASA RPG next week, but we’re also interested in hearing about anything Axanar-related in terms of video games. So if you’re working on a mod, or part of an Axanar influenced fleet in Star Trek Online, or just a fan of Trek video games, let us know! – DH


Some one involved with SFC/Dynaverse.net should drop them a line!  Especially if you are already a donor...

Offline Javora

  • America for Americans first.
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2986
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #78 on: July 28, 2015, 01:02:58 am »
Exeter already did in regards to SFC IV and got nowhere.  I wasn't in on the whole conversation but it sounded like they wanted a lot of cash.  Something we really can't do, but who knows, maybe they changed their minds.

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #79 on: July 29, 2015, 01:23:34 pm »
I was reading some fan comments about the "problem" of where (not to mention when) the Enterprise and, ostensibly, the other Constitution class ships were actually constructed. On the one hand we have the original idea that they were built in Earth orbit. On the other hand we have the JJ-verse idea that they were constructed Earth-side and somehow launched into space. On the third hand (in commemoration of Lt. Arex) we have Axanar saying that they were built at Axanar, which helps build up their story. Of course, what ST really needs is more contradictions, so this has only caused to help that out with more disagreements. Adding in "non-canon" stuff only makes it worse between registry numbers being out of sequence and other tales that don't appear onscreen.

I was going through the old TAS stuff recently and while most might not consider it "canon", I feel its pedigree is better than most simply because it was produced, written and acted by the TOS gang, albeit with limited resources; and while they flew a bit fast and loose with some of their own earlier concepts, it holds true to its roots pretty well. Two things struck me as significant to later incarnations of ST:


1) While not shown in use, it was mentioned that the Klingons have the cloaking device at their disposal. This is about ten years before STIII "introduced" it to the Klingons (originally by Kruge stealing one from the Romulans by way of the BoP, which was dropped from the storyline).


2) Captain April (now seventy-five year old Commodore April) states that he had watched the components of the Enterprise being constructed at the Earth Naval Yards in his youth. This was an interesting choice of words. He said "components" not "ship". Earth Naval Yards also implies a ground installation (at least to me) rather than a space based one.


This got me thinking. Perhaps JJ wasn't so far off? (Oh, the blasphemy! :mischief:)

Let's face it, construction in space is hard, even in the 23rd century. Between needing constant life support and time consuming and expensive zero G training, not to mention upping the chance of death even in a minor accident (again due to that bulky and expensive life support gear), it seems plausible that given their ability to control local gravity that it would be likely that certain parts of the ship were constructed planet-side. There, they could lighten or even remove all weight from the materials while allowing the workers the freedom of movement and ability that they are accustomed to during construction. Then, with the same gravity control (and probably some industrial transporters), they raise the parts into orbit for final assembly. So, engines and nacelles are produced one place in the yard, while saucer in another and secondary hull in another, etc.

Now, as far as Axanar goes the question remains: if this is true, why would they haul the components to another star system to assemble them? Well, there was a war on and Admiral Ramirez said that the new class of ship was proving more difficult than they had anticipated. It is possible that they felt that it was more secure at the center of the Federation and that it also cut down travel time between the races that were helping complete them. They had over a dozen races working on the Ares class, who knows how many were working on the Constitution class. Once the basic hull structures were completed they very well may have warp ferried them to Axanar for completion and installation of systems, which themselves were built on other worlds.

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #80 on: August 01, 2015, 11:02:20 am »
I read an interview months ago that said that the Enterprise seen being constructed in Axanar was not constructed at Axanar, it only looks that way from the way they edited Prelude.
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline TAnimaL

  • Lt.
  • *
  • Posts: 771
  • Gender: Male
    • Combat Logs from the Cold Depths of Space
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #81 on: August 01, 2015, 04:56:29 pm »
Ultimately it doesn't really matter if Enterprise was assembled on the ground or in orbit. To me it makes more a lot sense to put the components together in orbit (similar to TMP) rather than have the whole thing on the ground and having to get it to orbit as in JJ-Trek but the case can be made either way. The ship's dedication plaque clearly say "San Francisco," so we'll ahve to wait to see "Axanar" to see if they contradict that.

small quibble - the original plot of ST3 had Romulans using the Bird Of Prey but the studio wanted Klingons. I don't think there was ever any "Kruge steals a cloak" plotline, AFAIK

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #82 on: August 01, 2015, 06:25:40 pm »
How can they call it editing when the narrator specifically states that Klingon intelligence has learned that the ships are being built there? Unless they were feeding them false intelligence it seems pretty clear. If they were feeding them false intelligence, then Kharn isn't as good as they say he was because that would be something that you would want confirmed by actual eyes on sight, be it by long range probe or a person seeing it, before committing a bulk of your forces for an invasion.


As far as STIII, you may be right. I read that a looooong time ago some details may have been lost.

Offline Tulwar

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 1328
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #83 on: August 01, 2015, 10:39:10 pm »
I was reading some fan comments about the "problem" of where (not to mention when) the Enterprise and, ostensibly, the other Constitution class ships were actually constructed. On the one hand we have the original idea that they were built in Earth orbit. On the other hand we have the JJ-verse idea that they were constructed Earth-side and somehow launched into space. On the third hand (in commemoration of Lt. Arex) we have Axanar saying that they were built at Axanar, which helps build up their story. Of course, what ST really needs is more contradictions, so this has only caused to help that out with more disagreements. Adding in "non-canon" stuff only makes it worse between registry numbers being out of sequence and other tales that don't appear onscreen.

Don't give the JJ Abrams ST that kind of respect.  Everything Abrams presented in those films was completely backwards.  This is why the old fan hate him.  If a door was on the right in TOS, he put it on the left in his films.  ST IV, Kirk, "I was born in Iowa; I only work in outer space."  The same goes for the Enterprise.  In TOS, it was built in space, but in JJ Abrams film, it was built in Iowa.  It's a joke!  Get it?
Cannon (can' nun) n.  An istrument used to rectify national boundries.  Ambrois Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary

Offline FPF-Tobin Dax

  • D.Net VIP
  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2719
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #84 on: August 05, 2015, 02:16:30 pm »
From Axanar Q&A

Why do you say in Prelude to Axanar that the Enterprise is being built in orbit around Axanar when it was built over San Francisco?

We don’t say that.  Go back and listen to Prelude to Axanar again.  Silly human.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------They say that starfleets' heavy cruiser is being built at axanar. The video used over that is of 2 ships, one of which is the enterprise. It's a tease to use the enterprise shot, or that's SFX that were already rendered that was conveneient to use?
I guess other constitution ships might be there while the Enterprise and 1 other is assembled at earth.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2015, 02:30:01 pm by FPF-Tobin Dax »
Suspected leader of Prime Industries, #1 Pirate Cartel

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #85 on: August 05, 2015, 08:10:41 pm »
I never mentioned names. It said the new class of ship was being built there, hence the need for the attack. If they want to get specific, that's fine as Starfleet needed to get the bugs worked out before any others in the line were completed. We know Enterprise wasn't the first completed and there is no rule that says ships actually get built in the order they are numbered, especially if you are using different shipyards, so that jives well enough; except that the Klingons have three shiny new D7s headed for Axanar, so they had better have something in mind. 
:flame:

Offline Don Karnage

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2327
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #86 on: August 29, 2015, 07:56:31 am »
So when will it be finish? I mean that "movie"?

Offline Don Karnage

  • Lt. Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2327
  • Gender: Male
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #87 on: August 30, 2015, 05:19:47 pm »
Do they tell how much they have and how much they need?

Offline Corbomite

  • Commander
  • *
  • Posts: 2939
Re: Star Trek Axanar
« Reply #88 on: October 13, 2015, 12:19:23 pm »
Lookin' good so far...